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Rookie of the year debate...???...
01-01-2013, 06:45 PM
Post: #31
RE: Rookie of the year debate...???...
(01-01-2013 06:16 PM)nolan5000 Wrote:  Isn't there only 32 teams in the NFL?

Alex Smith, Michael Vick and others who lost starting job I would guess ...

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01-01-2013, 08:42 PM
Post: #32
RE: Rookie of the year debate...???...
RG3 is the real deal!

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01-02-2013, 02:16 AM
Post: #33
RE: Rookie of the year debate...???...
Yeah multiple qb's lost their jobs or went down to injury. If you went off of starting qb's numbers luck would have the worst completion % in the league. Right now he is only ahead of chad henne who came in for blaine gabbert in jacksonville

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01-02-2013, 10:59 AM
Post: #34
RE: Rookie of the year debate...???...
RGIII will win. He shouldn't. Quite simply, they have poured a lot of money into the RGIII hype machine and despite the fact that there are several good reasons why RGIII should not win.

1) Inflated stats due to lousy competition. The NFC East was horrible this year - especially on pass defense. RGIII loaded up on stats against some of the worst pass defenses in the NFL - the Saints, the Eagles, the Bucs, the Cowboys, the Giants - even the Ravens (who he didn't even beat, see point 2) . Against the only decent defenses he faced (Atlanta, Pittsburgh), he struggled. The fact is that the "highlight reel" of RGIII contains many plays where receivers did not have a defender within 10 yards of him. Other plays where receivers break short passes into long gains.

2) Of the three main rookies, he has the fewest wins - 8. Kirk Cousins put up good stats in the one game he started and should get credit for beating Baltimore due to scoring the tying touchdown and 2 point conversion.

3) Alfred Morris - Morris did well with RGIII out not counting Atlanta where Washington was way behind. Having a strong running game greatly helps the QB. 1600 yards from the top running back - Indianapolist did not have nearly as good of a running game.

4) The low interception total is a bit misleading. Thanks to poor competition and a short game passing offense (plus often playing with leads) RGIII did not have to take risks with the ball and could stick with safe passes. The fact is that in the last several games, the Eagles only intercepted one QB - RGIII. That alone should disqualify him from any sort of honor.

5) Believe it or not, Washington was closer (especially given the lousiness of the NFC East) to contention than people thought - their offense was pretty bad, but their defense isn't horrible.

6) Russell Wilson was better.

Russell Wilson won't win which is proper.

Seattle is a run and defense first team - in addition they had the least distance to go to become good. Wilson really took off the last part of the year but early on, Seattle was as much winning in spite of Russell Wilson and not because of him.

In anyway, barring jet lag, Russell Wilson will beat RGIII where it counts - on the field. I also believe that Wilson is likely to have a better overall career than RGIII.

Andrew Luck won't win. He should.

1) The Colts were 2-14 last year. The worst team in the entire NFL. They made the playoffs this year - yes, they added many offensive pieces, including Dwayne Allen and T.Y. Hilton and retained Reggie Wayne but its still a team which went from being the worst team in the NFL to making the playoffs.

2) Interceptions can be a highly misleading stat - Luck was tied with Drew Brees for most interceptions. Drew Brees. Like the Saints with Brees, the Colts did not have a single top back and were dependent upon passing. Like the Saints, the Colts often had to play from behind. The fact is that Luck had to two way more passing the ball than either RGIII or Wilson. RGIII was running a college offense designed to hide his flaws as a passer - Luck was running an NFL offense.

3) Bad offensive line

4) Luck was best near the end of the game

5) Yes, Reggie Wayne is awesome - better than any receiver that Washington or Seattle had. However, beyond that what do you have? Donnie Avery whose career was basically over due to injuries (admittedly Avery was still young and was a high second round pick, so the talent was there). T.Y. Hilton a rookie. Dwayne Allen and Cody Fleener - rookies. Add in running backs and you have Vick Ballard - rookie. Delone Carter - 2nd year barely played the first. Donald Brown - always injured. Basically Luck had one top receiver and a bunch of young guys or a guy coming off of injury. Ever think that maybe the reason why Donnie Avery is back to looking like a good receiver or that T.Y. Hilton and Dwayne Allen had very strong rookie seasons has something to do with Luck?

6) Expectations - yes, everyone expected Luck to be good - but the Colts were expected to be terrible. Quite simply, the Colts were in a major rebuilding. As it turns out, that seems to be more of a reloading. People thought that Washington had a decent chance to make the playoffs. The defense is decent and with any sort of offense they had a shot especially in a weak NFC East where the Giants and Eagles were decimated by injuries and the Cowboys are the Cowboys. Everyone thought that Seattle was going to be good - maybe the defense was better than expected, but again, them making hte playoffs is not a shock. Indianapolis winning 11 games and making the playoffs is a shock.

7) Value to team. Remove RGIII from Washington and Washington chrushed Cleveland (okay, Cleveland was bad) - they may well have made the playoffs with Kirk Cousins given the generally lousiness of the NFC East and the favorable schedule. Remove Wilson from Seattle and they likely still make the playoffs with a top defense and top running back. Remove Andrew Luck from Indianapolis and they almost no doubt have another top 10 pick in the draft. Luck was by far the most valuable to his team.

Andrew Luck will have the last laugh - the Colts are set up for the future with good young skills position players and an adequate defense. The pieces are in place for Luck to be one of the top quarterbacks for years.

And sorry to Matt Kahlil (who blocked for the second best running back season in all time and is already one of the best tackles in the league), Doug Martin (who was awesome), Alfred Morris (1600 yards and double digit touchdowns is insanely good), Trent Richardson (who played hurt most of the year with a terrible quarterback and still put up very good numbers), T.Y. Hilton (who came out of nowhere to be the best rookie wideout), and Dwayne Allen (he is going to be very good - a complete tight end whose numbers could well skyrocket over time) who were all awesome yet don't even merit discussion next to those three QBs. Even Ryan Tannehill did pretty decent considering how lousy Miami's run game and receivers were. In a normal year, any one of those players might merit consideration.
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01-02-2013, 11:51 AM
Post: #35
RE: Rookie of the year debate...???...
(01-02-2013 10:59 AM)ZSDOne Wrote:  the Giants and Eagles were decimated by injuries and the Cowboys are the Cowboys.

Hey, I take exception to this statement. The Cowboys were just as decimated by injuries as any NFL team. For the most part, the Cowboys were in most of the games, with a chance to win or tie, until the end.

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