[wickabee]

Really dude?? That's pitiful.

I know you're sad we stomped on the number one diving team in the league (the Canucks) but there is no way in the world you can tell me the Kings didn't earn that Cup.

Once, just once please read what I've written and forget a Canucks fan typed it out. Replying to the avatar instead of what's written is truly pitiful.

The Kings deserved to win the cup no question, and I haven't said otherwise. Going into last night's game I firmly believed they would not only win, but dominate while doing it. Unfortunately I didn't get to see it. Instead I watched the officials hand LA the cup on a platter. Considering they more-than-likely would have won it on their own, the officials did LA a disservice by putting on such an obvious show of it. Did LA dominate through the whole playoffs? Absolutely. Am I a bitter Canucks fan? No (so you can take that little theory and shove it). Did LA deserve to win THAT game? I don't know because they weren't given the chance.

Of course, you'll probably come back with another insult and completely ignore what was said again. Pitiful.

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Don't even pretend to know me or my motives when you can't even decipher what's written.

[phildo37]

Once, just once please read what I've written and forget a Canucks fan typed it out. Replying to the avatar instead of what's written is truly pitiful.

The Kings deserved to win the cup no question, and I haven't said otherwise. Going into last night's game I firmly believed they would not only win, but dominate while doing it. Unfortunately I didn't get to see it. Instead I watched the officials hand LA the cup on a platter. Considering they more-than-likely would have won it on their own, the officials did LA a disservice by putting on such an obvious show of it. Did LA dominate through the whole playoffs? Absolutely. Am I a bitter Canucks fan? No (so you can take that little theory and shove it). Did LA deserve to win THAT game? I don't know because they weren't given the chance.

Of course, you'll probably come back with another insult and completely ignore what was said again. Pitiful.

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Don't even pretend to know me or my motives when you can't even decipher what's written.

I'm not trying to sound sarcastic in saying this... you don't think the Bernier penalty was justified?

What I saw was Bernier lining up Scuderi for 30-40 ft, not slowing or letting up, watching Scuderi's back the whole time (Scuderi definitely didn't turn at the last second) and just plastered his head into the glass.

In my opinion that was the definition of a 5 & a game boarding/checking from behind penalty.

I think the shame is that Bernier put the refs in a position to make that call. At least he could slowed up a bit and maybe given them a reason not to call 5 & a game

But, yes, that call did somewhat ruin the game from a non-King-fan perspective. Anyone hoping for a close game like 1, 2, and 5 was disappointed pretty quickly into the game

[wickabee]

Show me where I said that about the Bernier hit. Show me. Can't find it? Maybe you were making an assumption...

The Bernier penalty was justified, but it wouldn't have happened if the other hit from behind was called. There were a plethora of other LA non-calls through the first 2 periods, but I'm not going to get into particulars. I thought the refs did a horrible job and it looked like someone had decided LA would win it tonight. I'm not taking away from the Kings. I'm not saying New Jersey would have or should have won it. I'm saying the refs were brutal.

The fact the Kings beat Vancouver in round 1 is only relevant to people like Vad who think the only motivation a Canucks fan has to say something about another team is "hating" on that other team. As if we can't POSSIBLY see something and have a genuine opinion. It's BS and I'm sick of it.

[onoxxxregretso]

I agree with you that the hit on Gionta should have been a minor for boarding. Then the Bernier hit never would have happened because they play would have been over. Aside from that I didn't really see much else that the refs missed...mind you I was playing poker from the middle of the second to the end of the game.

With that being said, Marty and the Devils in general were horrible last night. Marty looked good for the first five minutes then he fell apart. Yes go ahead and blame it on the Bernier penalty because it did change the momentum.

Also, congrats to the Kings and their fans. I'm looking forward to traveling two hours south to see the cup when DB brings it to Ithaca, NY.

[phildo37]

Show me where I said that about the Bernier hit. Show me. Can't find it? Maybe you were making an assumption...

The Bernier penalty was justified, but it wouldn't have happened if the other hit from behind was called. There were a plethora of other LA non-calls through the first 2 periods, but I'm not going to get into particulars. I thought the refs did a horrible job and it looked like someone had decided LA would win it tonight. I'm not taking away from the Kings. I'm not saying New Jersey would have or should have won it. I'm saying the refs were brutal.

The fact the Kings beat Vancouver in round 1 is only relevant to people like Vad who think the only motivation a Canucks fan has to say something about another team is "hating" on that other team. As if we can't POSSIBLY see something and have a genuine opinion. It's BS and I'm sick of it.

whoa man.. I read into what you were saying more specifically about last night's game than anything else... so yes, I was assuming you were talking about last night, not specifically Bernier. I said I wasn't trying to be sarcastic.. I wasn't trying to jump down your throat.. no need to jump down mine.

I think we can all agree that the officiating, this entire playoffs, was suspect.... and I'm not trying to defend the refs at all.. I had nothing vested in either team. I can definitely see where you're coming from in saying that it looked like "someone" wanted the Kings to win last night... and I think we've all felt that way about a team/series before. Stoll should've been penalized, that goal in game 4 where Brodeur had the puck under his pad - I think that should've been blown dead. I think the goalie interference was inconsistent. I'm not sure that Salvador should've gotten that 4-mn high sticking penalty (looked a bit like a follow-trough to me.. much like the "hockey play" in the previous game, I think, that the refs didn't call against LA). I think, all-in-all, the Devils did get the short end of the stick in the penalities department

Again, I agree that Stoll should've gotten a penalty, but to say that the Bernier hit wouldn't have happened if the Stoll hit was called is just not completely accurate. Scuderi was the first King to touch the puck after that hit, and even though the play would've been blown dead, Bernier was still full-steam-ahead toward Scuderi. Yes, maybe he lets up if he sees the ref's arm go up.. maybe

[wickabee]

It wouldn't have happened. Yes, it would hinge on Bernier seeing the arm go up, but how long would the arm have been up for him to see? Quite awhile and Bernier is not a dirty player.

And sorry for taking your previous post as such, but I never said a word about the Bernier hit, so I don't feel there was a need to bring it up or explain to me why it was a penalty even though I completely agree. I'm not 6, I don't need to be spoken to as such. I mistakenly figured it was yet another, "The team that benefited from the poor officiating beat your favourite team a couple months ago so you must just be complaining because you're bitter about losing" post. I'm tired of having people jump down my throat in that manner. Every team has lost to every other team at some point, so anytime I say anything about a team that isn't Vancouver that's less than positive, I must just be bitter about a loss somewhere in the past, and anytime I say something positive about Vancouver, I'm just wearing homer blinders. I can admit sometimes I wear the blinders, but there isn't a "team" fan alive that can honestly say they never do. Because I'm a Canucks fan and I don't shut up and agree with everybody that they're evil Satan worshipers who eat puppies, I'm the enemy. I don't regularly heap all that crap on others. When the Canucks are being ragged on it's all good with everybody, but should a Canucks fan say something about anyone else, well, there's a thread somewhere around here about Boston fans and racist comments. Check that thread out if you want to see how a Canucks fan is treated when he acts like everyone else does towards him.

At the end of it all, I'm just sick of people reading half a post and thinking they know me, my thoughts and motives. I'm sick of people reading half a post and ragging on me for the sin of liking a certain team. I'm sick of people looking at the avatar and not reading at all. These people know nothing more than who I cheer for. Too many times I get a post that can be paraphrased as, "You're a Canucks fan, so you're just hating on TEAM X". Let me give you a hint, if you can't read the post in its entirety and comprehend what's actually said, don't respond with idiocy that has nothing to do with anything.

Case in point, Vad's post that started this. Pitiful.

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and for the record, I didn't have any vested interest in this series either. I don't hate LA (some of their p[layers is a different story, but don't for a second think it's because they beat Vancouver. That is just STUPID). I really didn't care after Van and Ottawa were knocked out. I just wanted to see some good hockey. A few games I got that, but most of the time it was horrendous and the feather in the cap was the last game where the Cup was handed to LA on a platter even though they probably would have won it anyway.

[phildo37]

as often happens on these boards, just a series of reading into posts and making assumptions based on that... same as I assumed that you were speaking of the Bernier hit, it was assumed I was hating on you for being a Canucks fan. I only brought in the Bernier hit, because, to me, it the entire game was won in that 5mn powerplay... and you saying the refs handed the Kings the Cup on a platter.. I just made the correlation in my own mind. But, I certainly didn't (as clearly others did) think it was coming from a 'bitter Canucks fan'. I was very angry and disappointed with Weber being fined and not suspended for slamming Zetterberg's head into the glass, and then watched him play very well in games 2 and 3 when I thought he should be sitting... and you can add that to the many questionable calls/non-calls this entire playoffs

Ultimately, since I'm not in the camp of thinking you to be hating on a team because they beat the Canucks, I'll assume you're not speaking about me specifically... we've done trades before, and I'd like to trade again.. don't want any miscommunications/bad blood/ill feelings hanging over that

as to the Bernier hit, I still believe it likely would've happened. Granted, I've gone back and watched the video to be sure, but Bernier wasn't watching Stoll/Gionta.. and he put his head down and just barrelled toward Scuderi. I don't think he would've seen the ref's arm up until the last second.

[wickabee]

That's the thing, we'll never know. If the first one was called and Bernier still hit him like that, then there'd be no issue, would there?

And Phil, we've "known" each other quite some time now. I know you're not one of them, but at the same time I didn't think Vad was either. People surprise you sometimes, as he did. Honestly I replied to the post without fully realizing it was you, haha. Also, I've been trading online since late 09, but I've been discussing various topics on message boards for over 10 years, so you'd have to get pretty ridiculous for me to hold any bad blood towards you. This is just hockey, try getting into it over politics and music. You think hockey fans are loyal? Music fans are insane.

I'll give some examples of things I've seen on messageboards:

1: I used to co-run a site dedicated to Canadian music. One day a mid-level Canadian rock star came onto the boards and started talking to some people. I was watching his conversation in real time, refreshing the page every so often. It started out with some fans asking normal questions; Which is your favourite song you wrote, what do you think of this and that, etc, etc. Then one guy comes in and says something about meeting this mid-level rock star before a show and kicking a hackeysack around with him. Mr. Star goes nuts saying that never happened. Within half an hour he was all over the boards challenging random people to (no joke) screwdriver fights. Something like that may change my opinion of you.

2: I used to moderate a political/social board. Not a ton of members, but a close-knit community of people who weren't afraid to voice their opinions or tell you "you're wrong and here's why". Two well-known (among the community) members were actually married. They must have been having a fight in real life because they came on the boards simultaniously and started complaining about each other. Long story short, she announced to the world that he had trouble with stamina in the bedroom. He responded by telling everyone she had given him an STD after sleeping around on him. I heard later that they did get a divorce. Something like that may change my opinion of you.

Parroting what the media says may change my opinion of you. Assuming every comment I make can be traced back to which team I cheer for might change my opinion of you, as it changed my opinion of someone else in this thread.

With all that said, I never let what's said in a discussion get in the way of a trade/sale/purchase. An opinion does not speak to someone's character as a trader. I understand the fact that many people do let these things get in the way, I just don't understand why. Don't worry Phil, we're cool.
(actually I was going through some cards as I haven't been trading at all lately, and every time I came across a 90s insert, I thought of you).

[phildo37]

Re: Bernier hit - agreed... we'll never know.. can only watch the tape and guess, which is quite futile

I think many of us think a little faster than we read, especially when it comes to forums like this... I've definitely stuck my foot in my mouth before from doing that (as I have, to a degree, with this thread)

I can certainly relate to where you're coming from on all of this... I remember just earlier this playoffs, when some Rangers fans were getting cocky over their run, and it spilled over into taking shots at the Wings for being too soft.. I very clearly stated my feelings toward that.. changed my opinion of some folks too. People love to hate the Canucks and Wings...

That's the way I feel too... what's said on the forums is one thing, and when it comes to trading.. "business is business" so-to-speak. Although, I can't assume anyone feels the same way as I do regarding that..... if you still have some of those 90's inserts... well, I know I got a ton of Canucks cards for ya!

[wickabee]

I understand disliking a team. I can't stand the Bruins or the Blackhawks. I actually don't take offense to Canuck bashing as long as it's relevant and either clever or thoughtful. Nothing gets me more than hearing/reading the same thing over and over. I have to wonder if those who parrot this stuff think they're funny or smart for doing so, because in reality, it's quite the opposite.

Does Ryan Kesler dive? Yes, just as much as Dustin Brown does, along with half the league. But, the CBC focuses on Kesler, Burrows and Lapierre, so everyone pretends they're the only players in the league who do, in fact, dive. The best was the one clip of Kesler getting tied up with Richards, get turned around, catch an edge and fall. The CBC played that clip every night for the next two weeks while talking about diving. The funniest part of that is Kesler dove ridiculously later that night when Willie Mitchell cross-checked him and they didn't play that one. Instead of showing the actual dive, they showed him falling and called it a dive. It really amazes me how many people call themselves true fans of the game only to turn around and parrot whatever Ron McLean and PJ Stock have to say.

As for trading, I'm sending a PM once this is posted.