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PSA/PWCC Lawsuit (!!!!!!)
02-14-2020, 05:18 PM
Post: #1
Smile PSA/PWCC Lawsuit (!!!!!!)
Anybody else hear about the ongoing lawsuits against a couple of sports card memorabilia dealers AND a couple of sports card GRADING COMPANIES!! Latest article I've seen was in the Oregonian on 2/13/20.I recommend anyone and everyone who's reading this to google the article and check it out, it has all the facts like dates, names and quotes The class action complaint alleges that an Oregon company (and others) Defrauded Baseball Card Collectors alleging that these (dealers) companies knowingly altered cards and sold them for EXTREMELY HIGH PRICES both on ebay and other online auctions and in live auctions. The lawsuit also shows evidence that PSA from the parent company Collectors Universe co. engaged in fraud when they knowingly provided statements of authenticity AND HIGH GRADES for cards that had been altered (i.e. trimming, touch up painting etc)!!!! And this is only the latest in a long running controversy alleging the same claims against these and other companies. The litigation submitted in Orange County California names PWCC and PSA. Claiming they defrauded baseball card collectors by knowingly altering cards and then giving them high grades which made them cost Hundreds of Thousands and even over A MILLION dollars As one attorney stated (and I think personally that this is SO true) that "baseball cards that have been altered are only worth a fraction of these high price tags, because THE AUTHENTICITY IS (in part) THE BASIS OF THE VALUE OF A CARD for collectors"(!!!!!!!!!)
So, I think we've ALL wondered at one time or another whether the "fight is fixed" when it comes to the grading of and subsequent value of the cards we all collect so passionately. Well, there you go, these lawsuits may work towards confirming our worst fears. But, I suppose it is just like other things in life, do we let the proverbial "bad apples spoil the whole bunch?" My personal opinion is this: I CHOOSE to collect cards, I CHOOSE TO because I LOVE the hobby, I LOVE the sport of Baseball, and I love them so much that they're a part of me somehow. Whether my cards are worth a million dollars or ten bucks I'm not just gonna give it all up because of someone else's opinion of their monetary value. I mean, hey, just because a couple of teams i.e. a handful of players have cheated in the past few years do we just throw in the towel and abandon the game of Baseball? I choose not to. So after my rant what do you think?

"The Rose goes in the front big guy..."
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02-14-2020, 07:15 PM
Post: #2
RE: PSA/PWCC Lawsuit (!!!!!!)
I have never graded a card or paid for a graded card. Boy, do I look smart now!
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02-14-2020, 09:45 PM
Post: #3
RE: PSA/PWCC Lawsuit (!!!!!!)
Can you provide a link to the article?

[Image: u0vgF6d.jpg]
Collecting Detroit Tigers, HOFers, Nolan Ryan, Will Clark and Juan Soto

**If you are not able use one penny sleeve per card when shipping your trades do not bother sending me any trade offers.**
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02-15-2020, 01:05 AM
Post: #4
RE: PSA/PWCC Lawsuit (!!!!!!)
https://topclassactions.com/lawsuit-settlements/consumer-products/psa-card-class-action-says-altered-baseball-cards-graded-auctioned

I collect a little bit of everything Colorado Rockies, Colorado Avalanche, & my great, great uncle Jack Pfiester!
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02-15-2020, 08:36 AM
Post: #5
RE: PSA/PWCC Lawsuit (!!!!!!)
(02-14-2020 05:18 PM)ceylan00 Wrote:  My personal opinion is this: I CHOOSE to collect cards, I CHOOSE TO because I LOVE the hobby, I LOVE the sport of Baseball, and I love them so much that they're a part of me somehow. Whether my cards are worth a million dollars or ten bucks I'm not just gonna give it all up because of someone else's opinion of their monetary value. I mean, hey, just because a couple of teams i.e. a handful of players have cheated in the past few years do we just throw in the towel and abandon the game of Baseball? I choose not to. So after my rant what do you think?

+1

(02-14-2020 07:15 PM)kerryandbeth Wrote:  I have never graded a card or paid for a graded card. Boy, do I look smart now!

+1

I collect Hall of Fame baseball player cards and cards of current and retired superstars.



My Huge Wantlist: http://www.zeprock.com/WantList.html
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02-15-2020, 09:55 AM
Post: #6
RE: PSA/PWCC Lawsuit (!!!!!!)
Humans are to easily swayed by greed. The grading companies should stick specifically to grading. Once they become buyers and sellers the trap of greed slowly creeps in. Once it starts it never stops and only gets worse.
The pricing tiers are also a horrible business structure. Pricing should be based on turn-around time, not the value of a card.
Grading a $5 card and a $5000 card is no different nor any more difficult. And for that reason there should be no difference in Tier pricing structure. Again, a pathway to greed for unscrupulous management.

The hobby as well as the memorabilia hobby has suffered through long bouts of grown men playing on the wrong side of greed and lies numerous times in the past 45 years in order to defraud hobbyists and fatten their wallets.
It all reminds me of being a young kid in the 80's going to card shows and seeing these sloppy old grown men peddling their cards on tables looking for the next sucker or innocent kid to hustle. Then laugh and joke about it to the dealer at the next table as soon as they customer walked away.

Seen it so many times over my years and very rarely go to shows these days. Nor will I ever use PSA or BGS to grade/slab cards, just to much of that sloppy old guy at the table vibe running amock in these companies.
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02-15-2020, 11:13 AM
Post: #7
RE: PSA/PWCC Lawsuit (!!!!!!)
I haven't read it yet, but is this the same story that came out in the Washington Post last summer about the guy altering cards and made roughly 4m doing so? The FBI is doing an ongoing investigation. I've got a couple tests this week coming up so I didn't want to take the time to read the whole thing lol
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02-15-2020, 10:35 PM
Post: #8
RE: PSA/PWCC Lawsuit (!!!!!!)
As a collector that submits cards for grading semi-regularly I'm aware of the situation and monitoring it. I've touched base with someone that has a lot more information than me and in the most basic general sense, the stuff I collect is probably safe from what's going on here. That said, it isn't a good look if the accused are found to be doing wrong.

Since I definitely advocate for grading from a preservation sense, I'm doing my best to keep an open mind and keep up with all evidence shared with the public. I love this hobby. The people I've had the fortune of chatting with here and other platforms have been amazing. The things I see collectors do for each other always warms my heart, so I'm not going to let bad news push me towards cynicism (there's enough OTHER in the hobby already making me a cranky pants).

Everyone follow the updates, keep informed, and make the best decision for your needs as a collector in this hobby. I can't really speak towards anyone that's in this from a business standpoint as I have zero credibility there.

Seeking 2007 National Treasures Drew Brees Laundry Tag cards #'d to 10.
Trade/Buy for: Saints and Frank Thomas
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02-16-2020, 03:53 AM
Post: #9
RE: PSA/PWCC Lawsuit (!!!!!!)
Wow, some wise priorities from KB & Zep, & some insightful comments as well so far. Thank you all for your thoughts and for people just seeint the thread, keep it going...

"The Rose goes in the front big guy..."
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02-18-2020, 01:23 PM (This post was last modified: 02-18-2020 01:42 PM by mybuys2015@gmail.com.)
Post: #10
RE: PSA/PWCC Lawsuit (!!!!!!)
http://www.sportscardradio.com/class-act...probstein/
Wondering why PWCC is selling these in bulk recently? They were always single listings in the past.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Lot-10-1993-SP-Foil-Derek-Jeter-ROOKIE-RC-279-ALL-PSA-8-NM-MT-PWCC-/402076135320?hash=item5d9d9aef98%3Ag%3ANgQAAOSw%7EPdePdO3&nma=true&si=bMSjxvZsK9%252BwpXweRCaNzbBws%252Fc%253D&orig_cvip=true&nordt=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Lot-50-1993-SP-Foil-Derek-Jeter-ROOKIE-RC-ALL-PSA-8-NM-MT-PWCC-/352928341453?hash=item522c2b1dcd%3Ag%3ABwMAAOSwUeVeGOfS&nma=true&si=bMSjxvZsK9%252BwpXweRCaNzbBws%252Fc%253D&orig_cvip=true&nordt=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557
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