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Farewell to modern cards!
#1

Farewell to modern cards!
Traditionally the night before a President leaves office he delivers a 'farewell address' to the nation in which he speaks candidly about topics that were 'off limits' while running for office or attempting to govern. Whether it was George Washington warning that the growth of political parties would lead to failed government in 1796 or Dwight Eisenhower warning about the influence of the military industrial complex in 1960, these men have used their last opportunity to command the attention of the nation to say what they felt was important, what they felt needed to be said … political consequences be damned.

Today I say 'farewell' to modern cards and, while I am not a President, I feel that after 20 years of collecting that there are things I feel that are important, things I feel need to be said.

In 1992 I was ten years old and living in a town that was poverty stricken and experiencing a crime wave. The public schools were viewed as a dead end and were seen as dangerous. I was promptly transferred to a private school and found myself amongst strangers in the 4th grade. The fact that it was a private school meant that many of the students came from better financial situations and could afford 'extras', such as baseball cards. I got into collecting and quickly discovered a love for the hobby and the friendships came just as fast.

Trading was a big part of the routine at class and I often got yelled at for reading the back of a Benny Santiago baseball card when I should have been reading a chapter in Social Studied on the French and Indian War. On a bus ride home one day my best friend showed me the most beautiful card I had seen thus far. It was a 1991 Topps 1953 Archives Bob Schultz … a common reprint of a common card. I immediately traded my best card at the time (a 1992 Topps Ruben Sierra if memory serves). From a purely financial standpoint I had been suckered, but I learned something very important that day: there were cards that existed long ago and they were beautiful.

During my quest to buy pack after pack for trading I came upon a small shop the next town over, which happened to employ a school teacher part time who kept his collection of 1950s and 60s cards in the display case. On my first trip my mother noticed a 1954 Bowman Carl Erskine (whose autograph she had received in person at Ebbets Field in the mid 1950s) and I immediately bought the card, along with a 1968 Topps Don Drysdale, because I had seen him on a rerun of The Brady Bunch. By summer's end I had done the unthinkable: I had purchased a 1960 Topps Ken Boyer / Mickey Mantle for the princely sum of $12. I was ten years old and on my way.

As the years past I continued adding 1950s-70s cards in my collection with names like Clemete, Aaron, Brock, Perry, etc. finding their way into a modest collection that was the envy of every male friend I had … until puberty. Their cards of stars of the present lost value and with it their interest waned, but my cards had the excitement of up arrows in the monthly issue of Beckett I never left home without. And although I kept picking up vintage, I never stopped buying packs of modern. To me they went hand and hand.

Reading Beckett for all those years I thought that baseball cards began in 1948, because the earliest sets listed were '48 Bowman and '48 Leaf. Then came the internet and eBay and I discovered T206, 1933 Goudey, and countless other sets that captivated my imagination. As I got older, the budget became larger, and the cards became better. Ty Cobb, Tris Speaker, Christy Mathewson, Jackie Robinson, and Rogers Hornsby produced decades before I was born found their way next to Cal Ripken, Derek Jeter, and Mike Piazza. I started putting more into modern cards as well and began buying hobby boxes (I didn't even know packs came in boxes until about 9 years into the hobby!).

I was growing in the hobby and began attending Nationals. Soon Babe Ruth found his way into my collection, but so did modern patch cards, cut signatures, and all the other novelties today's manufacturers were turning out. By the end of my time at college I had amassed quite the collection, but had absolutely no one to share it with other than anonymous usernames on message boards such as this.

When I finished college my collection gained steam and I found myself buying more quality vintage and soon guys I thought were untouchable were in my collection. I picked up DiMaggio, Williams, more Cobbs, more Mathewsons, without so much as a second thought. But for every vintage card there was a shiny new Ott cut signature card or patch card to go with it. Things were going very well and I loved the hobby.

Then a funny thing happened in 2007. Topps released a Triple Threads booklet featuring Mantle and DiMaggio with stenciled outlines that featured NY # 7 and NY # 5. I loved the card and quickly snatched it up, but Mantle's material looked too new, too white. It didn't sit well with me and I immediately contacted Topps to ask what the material was. To my surprise they refused to tell me. I found this quite odd as Mantle had been face of Topps since 1952 and any Mantle memorabilia purchase would be a considerable expense and would obviously be recorded.

I concluded that Topps did not want me to know the answer, because it was mostly like from a post-playing career jersey worn briefly at an 'official major league game', but clearly one long after The Mick had hung up his spikes. This bothered me. I never purchased a Topps relic card again. I never purchased a box of Topps baseball again. The damage had been done, and although it took 5 years, it ultimately killed my love for modern cards.

Since that time Topps has been 'busted' for misrepresenting seat 'relics' for game used bat cards and their guarantee of authenticity has become increasingly more vague. I began purchasing only 'older' relic cards manufactured mostly by DLP, which sometimes showed a picture on the reverse and gave me some confidence. I added beautiful cards like a Jackie Robinson patch clearly cut from the red of his #42, a lace from one of Jimmie Foxx' gloves, and a button from Duke Snider's jersey amongst others.

I loved these cards and collectors on message boards loved them too. They couldn't care less about my vintage cards, so I kept piling on the modern just so I could have some social interaction with fellow collectors on the internet. Vain? Perhaps, but I'll be the first to admit that a lot of vanity goes into collecting. We buy cards we want people to see. We want to feel we have something special; we want to feel we have something important.

By 2010 I was putting five figures into 'the hobby' each year and began picking up rare pre-WW1 vintage, and even moved into the nineteenth century. I also began breaking cases of 'old' DLP products and continued adding to my Hall of Fame relic collection.

However, as I grew in the hobby I began to become more knowledgeable about the darker aspects of it. None came across as worse than the rampant amount of fake autographs and memorabilia being regularly sold in the hobby, as so expertly prosecuted by the Feds in Operation Bullpen.

If countless forgeries are from time to time sold by the most reputable of dealers and auction houses are being sold to collectors, then who is to say they aren't being sold to card manufacturers? We already had the notorious case in 2001 when several 'bad' Walter Johnson cut autographs were pulled from that year's SP Legendary Cuts.

Is a guarantee from a company that is no longer in business (DLP) or experiencing several difficulty (UD) worth anything? No. Is a vague sentence from Topps about the 'item' (notice I don't say 'relic') on their card worth anything? Again, no.

These companies are in the business of making money and just because they manufacture sports cards does not mean they are run differently than any other business. Their goal is simple: minimize cost; maximize profit. The Ruth bat featured in recent Topps products was identified as a fungo bat dated to his time as a coach with the Brooklyn Dodgers. No, the bat card you treasure so much and perhaps overpaid for did not send a dinger out of Yankee stadium; more likely it was used by The Babe as a cane to pop his head out of the dugout to wave to the children of Brooklyn hoping to glimpse one last look at their idol. Then there was the case of the Panini rep who I spoke to briefly some years ago, who detailed their attempt to acquire a Pete Maravich jersey for the launch of National Treasures, but would not step up to the plate to get the deal done.

The above are just two examples of the major card manufacturers unwillingness to pay 'top dollar' for the memorabilia they dissect for their cards. They're buying at wholesale prices, which leads me to believe the legendary memorabilia they're buying are not the rock solid authenticated Louisville Sluggers with side writing and factory records, but the off brands like Zinn Beck that measure and weight appropriate values to what the player was known to use.

And why did some legendary players only have a single issued relic card, or just a handful? Surely each bat, jersey, or pair of pants, produces the same number of relic swatches and therefore I would conclude that you could expect similar print runs. Did the card manufacturers buy fragments? Did they learn something about what they purchased that made them hault production? Surely if thousands, and even tens of thousands, were spent on a piece of game used memorabilia the card companies would be inclined to use every last swatch to squeeze as much money out of it as they could. This, for one, always troubled me.

If you had told me a week ago I could not trust Doug Allen (who was indicted on 18 serious counts of fraud) I would not have believed you. If you told collectors ten years ago they could not trust Bill Mastro (who allegedly trimmed down the PSA 8 Wagner) they would not have believed you either. If there is one thing I learned in 20 years is that you just can't trust anyone if you want to walk away clean. A piece of paper saying something is authentic does not make it authentic … no matter who signed it. All these manufacturers have is an LOA from someone with a 'name' in the hobby and nothing more, bought at the lowest price possible.

All it takes is for one 'bad' Babe Ruth, Lou Gehrig, or any of the other 'biggies' to be identified and the whole legend relic market collapses. At the end of the day I was just not convinced that every single card I owned was 'good' and so began the selling process. I wanted to get out in 1925, not 1935. The low end stuff went first just to test the waters. I came out 'about' even selling myself, but it was a hassle so I consigned some of the better stuff of players I wasn't 100-percent attached to and made enough that it gave me pause to consider selling the rest.

I gave it another year and finally decided to sell the rest. The true quality relics and autos that had been part of my collection for so long. Cards I had treasured; cards I had posted here; cards I thought I would keep forever. But at the end of the day was my beloved piece of red fabric stitched onto cream fabric that I stare at for hours each day really part of Jackie Robinson's #42, or was it just red fabric stitched onto cream fabric? I don't know. I don't ever want to know.

And so … they're gone. For someone else to enjoy or worry about; I leave that choice to them. I for one will use the money earned to fund my most significant purchase in the vintage world to date. What is the card? Perhaps you feel you deserve to know if you read this far, and perhaps you are right, but it would only be met with disappointment and confusion by collectors who are more likely to spend $600 on a superfractor of a 17 year-old who may never see a game in the majors than $6000 on a Hall of Fame legend who was dead six decades before they were born.

Farewell modern cards. Farewell modern collectors. Enjoy prospecting; I will be grave-digging.
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#2

RE: Farewell to modern cards!
While I agree with you about the trust issue nowadays and that Topps states that all signings are verified via a Representative they could offer proof about "fabric" authenticity. They could have a code on the card that matches something on their site that gives you the info about when it was worn and who it was purchased from. I don't think that would be that hard to do since they already have that info in their accounting dept. No one spends money, especially big money without verification of the item so they already have the info. They just choose NOT to share it with use. I would never chop down the apple tree because because a few apples rotted. We as collectors need to diligent with our collecting habits, more diligent than we use to be so we can verify items. What can we do from a collector stand point when we find problems like you described, pretty much nothing. The companies however can. They can allow the collector to exchange their product, regrade it or make a correction in some way. They choose again not to.
In a world where it is possible that a 5 year old is making our clothes and barley paid we count on the retailer to stop purchasing from them and purchase else where, however we don't stop buying clothes.
The world is full of people trying to take advantage of another person for self greed. We cannot let those few ruin something we love and enjoy. I hate finding out something I paid for is fake or even questionable. I worked hard for that money. Is there something I can do about it no, so I do all I can to not let it happen again.
I some cases it pushes use to far and we get totally discussed with the hobby because of people like you mentioned and I totally understand why you feel the way you do and did what you did. I enjoy collecting and hope I don't reach that level as so many time I have come close. Not just because of what you mentioned but due to prices that are charged via Topps. I think their proffit ls just over the top. Yes its a limited market but 3 and 4 hundred dollar packs are not in the best interest of collectors if they end up with something they could have bought on the bay for 20 dollars or less. That is the case many times.
Good luck with your other endeavors.
Will always be looking for 2012 or 2013 Panini Cooperstown Signatures for the two sets I'm building-Will trade in your favor--will ship first--Thanks
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#3

RE: Farewell to modern cards!
From a new guy who collects only GU/AU cards, this post is disheartening to say the least.
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#4

RE: Farewell to modern cards!
WOW that was long but well said.If i could afford vintage at the moment i would join you but for now i will stick with my griffey and braun.I do wish you the best of luck and im glad you are staying in the hobby and not walking away all together.
[Image: griffeyjr.jpg]
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#5

RE: Farewell to modern cards!
I agree about the cut auto's. those are forged a lot. But trust me, I've seen tons of videos of longoria signing stickers, other players signing on card, those are fine. I've also had doubts about relics. But they cannot lie or else they would be gone by now. I will only buy expensive relic cards if they say... "the relic contained in this card was personally worn by x in an official MLB game".
Collecting: Crede, Luck, Tannehill, Osweiler, Cobb

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#6

RE: Farewell to modern cards!
(08-10-2012, 06:06 PM)chasescardcave Wrote: But they cannot lie or else they would be gone by now.
I don't feel Topps has ever purchased a 2x4 and cut it up and placed it on a card and said, "Babe Ruth memorabilia" on it.

But I do believe that they have used 'event worn' memorabilia, such as an Old Timer's jersey, or a Coach's jersey, and used clever wording to give the impression it was from their career as a player.

But my greater concern is not with Topps, but with the people that Topps buys from. Topps is not out there bidding against the whales who collect memorabilia. Topps is looking for value, and there have been major memorabilia dealers who have sold forgeries, counterfeit memorabilia, etc. to unsuspecting buyers in the past.

How do we know Topps wasn't duped? The answer is, we don't.

And now that it's just a wood chip and we have no information about what the piece was before it was cut up, nor an image, we can't do our own research on the item.

The FBI is investigating auction houses, major dealers, etc. for forgeries and counterfeits. My biggest fear was that one of the buste dealers would strike a plea deal where he ID'd all of his fakes (similar to a serial killer revealing where the bodies were buried) and Topps, UD, DLP, etc. turned out to be one of the buyers.


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#7

RE: Farewell to modern cards!
That's a good point. but this card right here is as authentic as authentic gets: they put the mlb hologram on it and when u type it in on the site, it says pujols game worn jersey.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/2012-TOPPS-BOWMA...500wt_1182
Collecting: Crede, Luck, Tannehill, Osweiler, Cobb

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#8

RE: Farewell to modern cards!
(08-10-2012, 06:53 PM)chasescardcave Wrote: That's a good point. but this card right here is as authentic as authentic gets: they put the mlb hologram on it and when u type it in on the site, it says pujols game worn jersey.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/2012-TOPPS-BOWMA...500wt_1182
Topps has a license with MLB that gives them access to jerseys, bats, etc. directly from the source so I have no doubt that the current list of players is genuine.

My concern remains with the back catalog of legends.

Legends who have countless forgeries, counterfeits, etc. on the secondary market.

Legends who were retired decades before Topps ever produced a card.
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#9

RE: Farewell to modern cards!
(08-10-2012, 06:59 PM)bigguy219 Wrote: Topps has a license with MLB that gives them access to jerseys, bats, etc. directly from the source so I have no doubt that the current list of players is genuine.

My concern remains with the back catalog of legends.

Legends who have countless forgeries, counterfeits, etc. on the secondary market.

Legends who were retired decades before Topps ever produced a card.
oh... that makes more sense. I agree. I will never buy a mantle, gehrig, ruth relic ever. Seriously, they have produced 1,000's of ruth jersey cards. That would require at least 4 jersey's. Really? Where are they coming from?

Do you know if upper deck had a license with mlb too?
I recently bought this:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/200804572994?ssP...500wt_1204
Collecting: Crede, Luck, Tannehill, Osweiler, Cobb

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#10

RE: Farewell to modern cards!
(08-10-2012, 04:47 PM)bigguy219 Wrote: Enjoy prospecting; I will be grave-digging.
Awesome post...thank you for this. I've been struggling a lot with this over the last 2 years since I got back in the hobby. I love the history, look and feel of vintage baseball, but I still fall victim to the shiny new stuff here and there. Sooner or later I'll build up the courage (and the wallet) strong enough to follow in your footsteps.

[Image: 3XHoG.png][Image: untitled.png]
Collecting:Andrew McCutchen, Duke Snider & Brooklyn Dodgers
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I ship on weekends
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