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Hall of Fame Discussion..Everyone is welcome!
06-17-2011, 02:48 PM
Post: #41
RE: Hall of Fame Discussion..Everyone is welcome!
(06-17-2011 01:26 PM)gherkin1496 Wrote:  wow can we all agree that edgar renteria was a ridiculous proposition. has the guy ever been in teh top 20 players in teh game??? some of you are too hard some of you are too soft. btw...to even debate kent getting in is ridiculous. maybe the top hitting 2b of all time

You're right; I was TOO SOFT on that cheating gambler!!

A cheater is a cheater is a cheater is a cheater is a CHEATER!! Whether on the field or off, this person was a cheater!! I hope this scumbag cheater STAYS BANNED FOR LIFE!! And even then, that's still NOT long enough!!

What happened to society today??

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06-17-2011, 05:38 PM
Post: #42
RE: Hall of Fame Discussion..Everyone is welcome!
Common guys..Keep in civil and nice in here, lol..Let's just debate

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06-18-2011, 01:14 AM
Post: #43
RE: Hall of Fame Discussion..Everyone is welcome!
(06-17-2011 01:55 AM)yankeeempire Wrote:  I agree with evolb909's list but i think Piazza will have a hard time or he wont be 1st ballot because of the stink of possible steroid use. I just read in a article a few months ago that it will be tough for him.
You CANNOT crucify a person for something he did while not doing the other. He was busted as a manager not a player. You cannot deny the numbers Rose has or what he did while he was a player, However you cannot deny what he did as a manager and thats a stain that won't wash out. I personally don't like Rose but i feel he deserves to be put in the HOF for what he did on the field and not the dugout

agreed Rose should be in as a player as he may have been one of the top 10 all time players! and he was busted as a manager
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06-18-2011, 07:06 AM (This post was last modified: 06-18-2011 07:11 AM by nolan5000.)
Post: #44
RE: Hall of Fame Discussion..Everyone is welcome!
(06-17-2011 01:55 AM)yankeeempire Wrote:  You CANNOT crucify a person

The ONLY person that was crucified was Christ Jesus!!
(06-17-2011 01:55 AM)yankeeempire Wrote:  However you cannot deny

I CAN!! I CAN!!
(06-17-2011 05:38 PM)TheEvilEmpire Wrote:  Come on guys..Keep it civil and nice in here, lol..Let's just debate

I was being civil...

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06-18-2011, 09:36 AM
Post: #45
RE: Hall of Fame Discussion..Everyone is welcome!
(06-17-2011 12:43 PM)griffan15 Wrote:  If you measure the steroid users vs the steroid users, then yes, Bonds, Clemens and A-Rod will be in based on numbers.

Bonds, Clemens, Arod without the steroids would probably still be in consideration with numbers close to Frank Thomas/Tom Glavine.

McGwire/Sosa/Palmeiro without the steroids and we're talking Carlos Delgado territory.

Sheffield without steroids and you're in Dale Murphy territory and so on.

I understand what you're saying but what they would do without steroids is obviously speculation. All we can go off of is how they performed. The numbers are obviously there for Bonds and so forth.

IMO if you get caught with steroids you shouldn't be in the HOF but if they do allow 1 player in who used steroids, they have to be able to give everyone else the same opportunity based on numbers ONLY.

It will be a sad day if the HOF lets a steroid user in and essentially baseball would be saying its OK to use steroids. What a mess baseball got itself into!!

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06-18-2011, 09:42 AM (This post was last modified: 06-18-2011 09:43 AM by nolan5000.)
Post: #46
RE: Hall of Fame Discussion..Everyone is welcome!
It would also be a sad day if the HOF let the cheater in. If the HOF lets the cheater in it would have to be renamed the HOS

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06-19-2011, 01:41 AM
Post: #47
RE: Hall of Fame Discussion..Everyone is welcome!
Pujols is a 1st ballot HOFer, I think Soriano will make it, I think ARod has a shot, but the steroid scandal may be the decider. There are a handful of others, but I can't think of any off the top of my head (it's late)

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06-19-2011, 06:11 PM
Post: #48
RE: Hall of Fame Discussion..Everyone is welcome!
As for the steroids I dont want the player to be allow in but if they do I hope it was the players before the crack down. Players like Manny are cheaters because he was caught twice after the crack down. as for Rose he was caught placing a bet on HIS team. That shows faith in his team and he didnt cheat by throwing the games!

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06-20-2011, 04:31 PM
Post: #49
RE: Hall of Fame Discussion..Everyone is welcome!
I think we have to keep in mind that we're talking about the Hall of Fame. It is not the Hall of Great Players. Being a great player definitely helps but being "Famous" is what it is all about. Fan favoritism only goes so far. You have to consider each players resume. Stats is a huge plus because they are accumulated over years and years. You have to be a pretty good player to play in the majors for years and years. You also have to take into consideration accolades and awards. This is where the Fame comes into play. League Leaders, All-Star selections, MVPs, Cy Young Awards, Silver Sluggers and Gold Gloves. Those are what make a player truly famous and once again, it is the Hall of "Fame".

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06-21-2011, 01:13 AM (This post was last modified: 06-21-2011 01:28 AM by evolb909.)
Post: #50
RE: Hall of Fame Discussion..Everyone is welcome!
A few of you don't agree with Jack Morris and Alan Trammell but here's my arguement:

JacK Morris: Winningest pitcher of the 1980's. 4 World Series Rings including 1991 WS MVP. 5x All Star. 254 wins and 2,478 K's. He doesn't get in soon but one day just like Blyleven.

Alan Trammell: .285 career avg. 2,365 hits, 1,003 RBI. 6x All-Star. 1984 WS MVP.
compare to Ozzie Smith - .262 career avg. 2,460 hits, 793 RBI. Ozzie does have way more stolen bases (580) AS appearances (15) and Gold Gloves (13) but I think Tram has an outside shot.

Shoeless Joe: some people don't know this but here were his stats during the "Black Sox" Series:
.375 avg, 5 runs, 6 RBI, 1.000 fielding percentage...
Edgar Renteria - Shortstop. .287 career avg., 898 RBI, 2,277 hits, 425 2B. 2010 WS MVP + 2 WS rings. He's only 35 so he has an outside chance at 2,600+ hits if he stays healthy enough. No doubt he is a stretch, but he is a SS.

Omar Vizquel - Another outside shot at best but he is a SS. 11x gold gloves, .273 career avg., 449 2B, 944 RBI, 2,826 hits.
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