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The HOF is...
#41

RE: The HOF is...
Sorry...I do not, nor have ever, loved Mariano. In fact, there are 4 closers that I enjoyed watching and none of them were him. He got the 3-4 inches off the plate call all the time...anybody can be successful that way.

There is one thing I have not seen in this whole HOF voting debate about deserving 100%:

There is no 'I' in team, and all those players mentioned above had a great team to help them achieve their status, so maybe that was a factor in the voting. You know, how would they have performed on a much less successful team?

Remember Albert Pujols? The Angels couldn't wait to get him after his success with the Cardinals...now nobody talks about his career because the Angels failed as a team. Mike Trout will probably be the exception someday, but I think the voters have more to look at than just stats.
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#42

RE: The HOF is...
Hall Of Popularity. J.J. Putz got a vote. I lost respect for the Hall Of popularity a long time ago.
Explain this to me, (WITHOUT PERSONAL FEELINGS INVOLVED)...
How is it that Barry Bonds is not in the HOF? If you say cheating...

Gaylord Perry (HOF), known for his spitball was caught on August 23, 1982 and ejected from the game.

Whitey Ford (HOF) "was open to admitting to all kinds of shenanigans after his playing days were over. "I didn't cheat until later in my career when I needed something extra to survive. Ford said he would use his wedding ring, his belt buckle or catcher Elston Howard's shinguard to scuff the ball, as well as a "gunk" composed of baby oil, turpentine and resin."

Don Sutton (HOF) was notorious for the ways in which he would deface baseballs. "Sutton has been accused of cutting, scuffing, sandpapering, and generally disfiguring balls in so many ways that he says, 'I ought to get a Black & Decker commercial out of it."
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#43

RE: The HOF is...
I think its the type of cheating that was done.

Spitballs, nail files etc...in baseball are considered "nostalgic" ways of cheating, and are therefore sort of frowned upon, but are generally laughed at. Phil Niekro is another one. I still remember the game where he not so stealthily dropped all kinds of stuff onto the pitchers mound when confronted by an umpire.

Society has decided, at least at this time, that injecting drugs or just using drugs to enhance performance is on a whole different level. Same with the high tech cheating. I dont think history will look too kindly upon Altuve and Bregman unless there is a change in what society accepts.
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#44

RE: The HOF is...
"Type of cheating" sounds like a double standard. Illegal is illegal. If its something that will give you an unfair advantage and cause you to get ejected from the game (ie. Using corked bats), there is no difference. Its all personal opinion which makes it the Hall Of Popularity.
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#45

RE: The HOF is...
Drinking and driving is WAY different than lying to your kids. I mean, come on.

...well, unless you are lying to your kids about drinking and driving, that is.
There is a God and his name is Billy Joel
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#46

RE: The HOF is...
It is not the Hall of Clean Living...it is called the Hall of Fame because it IS based on popularity. Nobody is famous without fans, so some will make it due to being adored in spite of any issues during their career. And we should be fine with that as fans of the game.
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#47

RE: The HOF is...
(01-30-2020, 09:28 AM)jbissell Wrote: I think its the type of cheating that was done.

Spitballs, nail files etc...in baseball are considered "nostalgic" ways of cheating, and are therefore sort of frowned upon, but are generally laughed at. Phil Niekro is another one. I still remember the game where he not so stealthily dropped all kinds of stuff onto the pitchers mound when confronted by an umpire.

Society has decided, at least at this time, that injecting drugs or just using drugs to enhance performance is on a whole different level. Same with the high tech cheating. I dont think history will look too kindly upon Altuve and Bregman unless there is a change in what society accepts.
That was his brother, Joe Niekro, when pitching for the Twins. Big Grin
I collect a little bit of everything Colorado Rockies, Colorado Avalanche, & my great, great uncle Jack Pfiester!
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#48

RE: The HOF is...
Oops my bad! I coulda sworn it was Phil.
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#49

RE: The HOF is...
(02-03-2020, 12:11 AM)kerryandbeth Wrote: It is not the Hall of Clean Living...it is called the Hall of Fame because it IS based on popularity. Nobody is famous without fans, so some will make it due to being adored in spite of any issues during their career. And we should be fine with that as fans of the game.
Great point!
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I guess if I saved used tinfoil and used tea bags instead of old comic books and old baseball cards, the difference between a crazed hoarder and a savvy collector is in that inherent value.
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#50

RE: The HOF is...
All of the HOF, hockey included are the Hall of good. I also agree that unanimous is not that important. When it's voted on by people who cover teams there is room for bias. Imo throughout history there were better players than Mariano who received the only 100% vote.
Collecting Vintage OPC and older oddball and food issues as well as Maple Leafs.

Enjoy the hobby at it's purest form, treat it as you did as a kid.
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