[Marinoisking]

I get that. But "almost" doing something is a lot different than doing it. Our only loss is to the Patriots (and we were right there with 'em). Eli DIRECTLY cost the Giants their game today against SEATTLE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I'm not going to sugar coat anything. Rivers has got off to a slow start this year. But a lot of his "mistakes" haven't been on him. 4 or 5 of his INT's were fluke's. 2 by D-Linemen, and multiple one's that hit off of WR's hands. But most importantly none of them were back breakers like Manning's pick-six he threw to Browner today.

I might be biased but in my eye's Rivers is head and shoulders above Manning skill-wise.

so all of Elis mistakes and losses are all his fault...but everytime rivers has messed up it was a fluke? lol

Almost and did happen are the same thing when it comes to judging things like this....it dosent make Rivers mistake go away bc the Broncos couldnt put it in.


me and you have had this argument for about 5 months now lol
You like Rivers over Eli...I am Vice Versa....but I guess we will see were this season goes!

[bakerman8419]

I get that. But "almost" doing something is a lot different than doing it. Our only loss is to the Patriots (and we were right there with 'em). Eli DIRECTLY cost the Giants their game today against SEATTLE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I'm not going to sugar coat anything. Rivers has got off to a slow start this year. But a lot of his "mistakes" haven't been on him. 4 or 5 of his INT's were fluke's. 2 by D-Linemen, and multiple one's that hit off of WR's hands. But most importantly none of them were back breakers like Manning's pick-six he threw to Browner today.

I might be biased but in my eye's Rivers is head and shoulders above Manning skill-wise.

Rivers needs a signature game and folks will come around. Rivers has been in the league since 04 and I dont remember any significant game changing moments by him. I know you watch them more than I do probably by alot but when I think of Eli I think of the greatest play in Super Bowl history knocking off the much hated Pats who were 18-0 at that point and protecting the 1972 Phins perfect season. Yes its always about the Phins for me but until Rivers has that one win I have him under Eli.

Big time players make big time plays in big time games. Eli has done that. Also not to pile on Rivers cuz God knows I wish he was a Phin but he has been in the easiest division to win his whole career and still cant get to the big game and he had LT, Gates and V Jack.

[ejnfl24]

so all of Elis mistakes and losses are all his fault...but everytime rivers has messed up it was a fluke? lol

Almost and did happen are the same thing when it comes to judging things like this....it dosent make Rivers mistake go away bc the Broncos couldnt put it in.


me and you have had this argument for about 5 months now lol
You like Rivers over Eli...I am Vice Versa....but I guess we will see were this season goes!

I failed to realize where I said that they did. But this week his mistake(s) directly caused the Giants loss to the Seahawks. I did say Rivers has got off to an unexpectedly slow start but a lot of his INT's haven't been bad throws is what I'm getting at.

I guess for now we can agree to disagree.

[Marinoisking]

I failed to realize where I said that they did. But this week his mistake(s) directly caused the Giants loss to the Seahawks. I did say Rivers has got off to an unexpectedly slow start but a lot of his INT's haven't been bad throws is what I'm getting at.

I guess for now we can agree to disagree.

agree to disagree lol
BTW I found some stats with week 5's numbers added

ELI
att cmp yds td INT
164 104 1486 11 5

Rivers

186 125 1536 6 7

You gotta give Eli some credit....he has put up pretty good numbers this year....he does have fewer picks than Brady still

[ejnfl24]

Rivers needs a signature game and folks will come around. Rivers has been in the league since 04 and I dont remember any significant game changing moments by him. I know you watch them more than I do probably by alot but when I think of Eli I think of the greatest play in Super Bowl history knocking off the much hated Pats who were 18-0 at that point and protecting the 1972 Phins perfect season. Yes its always about the Phins for me but until Rivers has that one win I have him under Eli.

Big time players make big time plays in big time games. Eli has done that. Also not to pile on Rivers cuz God knows I wish he was a Phin but he has been in the easiest division to win his whole career and still cant get to the big game and he had LT, Gates and V Jack.

It's not Rivers fault our teams have faltered in the playoffs though. L.T. missed a lot of snaps in a couple of our playoff runs, and Kaeding is a SHANKAPOTAMOUS once postseason play begins. I know Rivers won't get his due until he step onto the biggest stage and leads us to a championship. But I also don't think a lack of team success should be the thing to bring down his stature as an elite QB.

---

agree to disagree lol
BTW I found some stats with week 5's numbers added

ELI
att cmp yds td INT
164 104 1486 11 5

Rivers

186 125 1536 6 7

You gotta give Eli some credit....he has put up pretty good numbers this year....he does have fewer picks than Brady still

Eli has played fine this year aside from today's choke job against the Seahawks. I'll give him that.

[Marinoisking]

It's not Rivers fault our teams have faltered in the playoffs though. L.T. missed a lot of snaps in a couple of our playoff runs, and Kaeding is a SHANKAPOTAMOUS once postseason play begins. I know Rivers won't get his due until he step onto the biggest stage and leads us to a championship. But I also don't think a lack of team success should be the thing to bring down his stature as an elite QB.

---

Eli has played fine this year aside from today's choke job against the Seahawks. I'll give him that.

and dont forget all the WR problems the Giants have had this year

I was about to say what Bakerman said....last year the Chargers had the number one O and number one D...yet they didnt even make the playoffs....it seems like the past 3 or 4 year I have been waiting on Rivers to take that final step...and its just not happened.
You guys get what...Broncos,Raiders,and Cheifs twice a year?
The Giants have the Eagles,Cowboys,and Redskins twice a year

I want to see Rivers step up...
He is in the absolute peak of his prime right now....he should have more TD's than INT's so far.....but I do think Ryan Matthews is going to help him out a lot as the year goes on...so I do expect to see better numbers from him....and I expect Eli to only get better as well.

[dfcj1499]

I wouldnt say Eli is riding Peyton's coat tails. I think he's more scrutinized than others because of his name. Yea he throws alot of picks but he also throws alot of TD passes. He takes risks. He can march down the field for the win. That scramble and completion to David Tyree against the Pats that led to the Game-Winning TD in the Super Bowl was the aggist thing ive ever seen! Favre was the same way. And some may argue that favre was the best QB of all-time. Not saying he's favre but he's like Favre. Eli is under-rated IMO. IMO, Rivers is better.....and as far as Vick....every QB gets rattled under a penetrating Defensive pass-rush. For example; look at Aaron Rodgers Sunday Night against the Falcons. When Vick gets good protection, he's an incredibly accurate passer with infinite range!

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and dont forget all the WR problems the Giants have had this year

I was about to say what Bakerman said....last year the Chargers had the number one O and number one D...yet they didnt even make the playoffs....it seems like the past 3 or 4 year I have been waiting on Rivers to take that final step...and its just not happened.
You guys get what...Broncos,Raiders,and Cheifs twice a year?
The Giants have the Eagles,Cowboys,and Redskins twice a year

I want to see Rivers step up...
He is in the absolute peak of his prime right now....he should have more TD's than INT's so far.....but I do think Ryan Matthews is going to help him out a lot as the year goes on...so I do expect to see better numbers from him....and I expect Eli to only get better as well.

And that was without Vincent Jackson! Rivers will find his way.The Chargers always start out slow. It's a miracle that they're 4-1

[ejnfl24]

I was about to say what Bakerman said....last year the Chargers had the number one O and number one D...yet they didnt even make the playoffs....it seems like the past 3 or 4 year I have been waiting on Rivers to take that final step...and its just not happened.

Yeah, we had the best offense (led by Rivers...), and the best statistical defense but we gave up an NFL worst in yards per return allowed, had multiple punts/kicks blocked, and gave up way too many return TD's. We had arguably the WORST special teams unit last year which is why we didn't make the playoffs.

[mrgonzodad]

Eli shmelie, he is an above average STARTING qb. Starting is the key word.
I've had enough of his hang in the pocket too long, snowball in hell, comes up 5 yards shorter than it should be pass to Tyree in the SB.
He would start for pretty much any team in the league other than about 4 teams. I honestly can't tell if he takes too many risks or just makes bad decisions sometimes.
Eli is a starting qb in the NFL, but he's a notch below the #6 guy, yet 2 notches above the likes of Kitna, Tavaras Jackson, Alex Smith, McNabb, Sanchez, Cassel, etc.
SLIGHTLY overrated IMO.

[dfcj1499]

Eli shmelie, he is an above average STARTING qb. Starting is the key word.
I've had enough of his hang in the pocket too long, snowball in hell, comes up 5 yards shorter than it should be pass to Tyree in the SB.
He would start for pretty much any team in the league other than about 4 teams. I honestly can't tell if he takes too many risks or just makes bad decisions sometimes.
Eli is a starting qb in the NFL, but he's a notch below the #6 guy, yet 2 notches above the likes of Kitna, Tavaras Jackson, Alex Smith, McNabb, Sanchez, Cassel, etc.
SLIGHTLY overrated IMO.

Theres definetly some bad decisions there