[kickstand54]

pwescott Wrote:Come on guys, Reggie Bush is not better than Maurice Jones-Drew or Deangelo Williams, but you price him like he is. He can't even start on his own team. But for some reason, you think he still plays for USC and he's dominating the game, but look at the numbers, not even close!

I generally agree with the premise of this thread, but in all fairness, the best players aren't always the highest priced.  Bush flat out sells higher than either of the players you mentioned.
http://cgi.ebay.com/Reggie-Bush-06-SP-Au...414c9fcffe
http://cgi.ebay.com/2006-SP-Authentic-MA...58837e14e8

[hemipowered]

Kickstand54 Wrote:

pwescott Wrote:Come on guys, Reggie Bush is not better than Maurice Jones-Drew or Deangelo Williams, but you price him like he is. He can't even start on his own team. But for some reason, you think he still plays for USC and he's dominating the game, but look at the numbers, not even close!

I generally agree with the premise of this thread, but in all fairness, the best players aren't always the highest priced.  Bush flat out sells higher than either of the players you mentioned.
http://cgi.ebay.com/Reggie-Bush-06-SP-Au...414c9fcffe
http://cgi.ebay.com/2006-SP-Authentic-MA...58837e14e8

There's a flaw in your assertion-

#1 - the Saints just one the Super Bowl- Brees, Shockey, etc - ALL UP
#2 (AND THIS IS THE BIG THING YOU MISS) is the Bush card is #'d to only 299 while the Jones Drew is 999!! Three times the supply. Overall- cards being equal prior to the super Bowl win- Jones drew has done much better in auctions. Deangelo Williams doesn't do well, partly because of James Stewart.

[pwescott]

HemiPowered Wrote:

Kickstand54 Wrote:

pwescott Wrote:Come on guys, Reggie Bush is not better than Maurice Jones-Drew or Deangelo Williams, but you price him like he is. He can't even start on his own team. But for some reason, you think he still plays for USC and he's dominating the game, but look at the numbers, not even close!

I generally agree with the premise of this thread, but in all fairness, the best players aren't always the highest priced. Bush flat out sells higher than either of the players you mentioned.
http://cgi.ebay.com/Reggie-Bush-06-SP-Au...414c9fcffe
http://cgi.ebay.com/2006-SP-Authentic-MA...58837e14e8

There's a flaw in your assertion-

#1 - the Saints just one the Super Bowl- Brees, Shockey, etc - ALL UP
#2 (AND THIS IS THE BIG THING YOU MISS) is the Bush card is #'d to only 299 while the Jones Drew is 999!! Three times the supply. Overall- cards being equal prior to the super Bowl win- Jones drew has done much better in auctions. Deangelo Williams doesn't do well, partly because of James Stewart.

That's a good point, it will cool down soon enough. I just don't get the hype sometimes, was it Bush's 25 yards rushing in the Superbowl or his 38 yards recieving? Oh and did I mention ZERO touchdowns? Pierre Thomas should get more love than he does(30 rush, 55 rec + 1 TD). What a backward world we live in. I feel sorry for the guy who buys the Bush rookies now for top dollar and see in the next 5 years that he doesn't even finish in the top 100 RBs of all-time. Sure I'll give him the "explosive" title, but no more explosive than a Darren Sproles or Leon Washington(both of which I would take over Bush). Anybody else agree?

[kickstand54]

HemiPowered Wrote:
There's a flaw in your assertion-

#1 - the Saints just one the Super Bowl- Brees, Shockey, etc - ALL UP
#2 (AND THIS IS THE BIG THING YOU MISS) is the Bush card is #'d to only 299 while the Jones Drew is 999!! Three times the supply. Overall- cards being equal prior to the super Bowl win- Jones drew has done much better in auctions. Deangelo Williams doesn't do well, partly because of James Stewart.

There is no flaw in my assertion.  I follow all 3 players' cards and I have for a long time.  Bush sells higher than the other two regardless of this SB victory.  Follow the sales for awhile and you will find what I already know to be true.  I was just giving a snapshot as I did not have the time nor the inclination to post a bunch of sales to prove my point.  Thanks for your opinion though.
Here's a better example - all are /99, MJD and Dwill have nicer patches, and the Reggie was sold before the SB:
http://cgi.ebay.com/2006-UD-Exquisite-Ma...4ced8b68e2
http://cgi.ebay.com/2006-REGGIE-BUSH-EXQ...1e5a39723f
http://cgi.ebay.com/2006-DeAngelo-Willia...4ced5527d5

[kickstand54]

HemiPowered Wrote:Overall- cards being equal prior to the super Bowl win- Jones drew has done much better in auctions. Deangelo Williams doesn't do well, partly because of James Stewart.

First of all, you have no clue what you're talking about.  You are either making this up because you don't know, or you are flat out lying.  MJD sells very cheap and has for a long time.  I collect MJD and follow his cards closely and I can tell you that he has not sold higher than Reggie Bush in the last year and a half, period.
Secondly, it's Jonathan Stewart.
http://cgi.ebay.com/BGS-9-5-REGGIE-BUSH-...3ca9b2ebb5
http://cgi.ebay.com/06-Contenders-MAURIC...27aed72ace
http://cgi.ebay.com/2006-PLAYOFF-CONTEND...56397757ed  (And please don't tell me the 9 auto will make up for the $125 discrepancy in price)

[kickstand54]

bump

[stryke3]

I've got a simple solution to the whole matter... Those of you who support Beckett, continue to subscribe. Those who disagree with Beckett and who don't want to buy it anymore...then don't buy it anymore. There's no reason to start an argument for the heck of it. One side has their opinions, the other side has theirs. I think we can all agree that those viewpoints aren't going to change by reading what the other has to say.

[hemipowered]

Kickstand54 Wrote:

HemiPowered Wrote:Overall- cards being equal prior to the super Bowl win- Jones drew has done much better in auctions. Deangelo Williams doesn't do well, partly because of James Stewart.

First of all, you have no clue what you're talking about.  You are either making this up because you don't know, or you are flat out lying.  MJD sells very cheap and has for a long time.  I collect MJD and follow his cards closely and I can tell you that he has not sold higher than Reggie Bush in the last year and a half, period.
Secondly, it's Jonathan Stewart.

Chill out on the name insults- I am more than happy to discuss a point and argue, but if you want to turn this into a internet tough guy thing that goes no where except downhill - I don't have time for that.

your right- my bad on the wrong first name on Stewart (there was a RB with that first name and I had a end of year brain fart)- I haven't collected Jones-Drew for a while- the JAGS suck so he has come down- although there was a time not long ago his stuff was hot. He's still getting $150+ for his better rookies, which isn't bad. I can remember times early in this year Bush cards weren't selling that well.

In the end, what does this discussion prove- J-Drew cards are selling at a bargain and Reggie Bush is still way OVER- priced. Reggie was probably the most over-hyped rookie in the history of the NFL- he is a part time player and was in no way worth the 2nd overall pick. Pierre is a MUCH better every down back.

You can also take this from this discussion- The success of a team greatly benefits the player- if you put Jones-Drew on the Saints and Reggie on the small market (and one of the worst card following fan bases) Jacksonville = you can switch the prices around.

BTW, The point I made about Bush's rookie #'d to 299 and Jones-Drew #'d to 999 was a very valid comment. it goes to the supply and demand issue.

Save the insults- it's a hobby, I'm not on here to lie- where's the benefit. I haven't tracked the two over the last year, but i know there was a time maybe two years ago that Jones-Drew cards were red hot and outselling Bush- the prices in Beckett did not reflect that, you very well could be right over the time period you mentioned.

[kickstand54]

HemiPowered Wrote:

Kickstand54 Wrote:

HemiPowered Wrote:Overall- cards being equal prior to the super Bowl win- Jones drew has done much better in auctions. Deangelo Williams doesn't do well, partly because of James Stewart.

First of all, you have no clue what you're talking about.  You are either making this up because you don't know, or you are flat out lying.  MJD sells very cheap and has for a long time.  I collect MJD and follow his cards closely and I can tell you that he has not sold higher than Reggie Bush in the last year and a half, period.
Secondly, it's Jonathan Stewart.

Chill out on the name insults- I am more than happy to discuss a point and argue, but if you want to turn this into a internet tough guy thing that goes no where except downhill - I don't have time for that.

your right- my bad on the wrong first name on Stewart (there was a RB with that first name and I had a end of year brain fart)- I haven't collected Jones-Drew for a while- the JAGS suck so he has come down- although there was a time not long ago his stuff was hot. He's still getting $150+ for his better rookies, which isn't bad. I can remember times early in this year Bush cards weren't selling that well.

In the end, what does this discussion prove- J-Drew cards are selling at a bargain and Reggie Bush is still way OVER- priced. Reggie was probably the most over-hyped rookie in the history of the NFL- he is a part time player and was in no way worth the 2nd overall pick. Pierre is a MUCH better every down back.

You can also take this from this discussion- The success of a team greatly benefits the player- if you put Jones-Drew on the Saints and Reggie on the small market (and one of the worst card following fan bases) Jacksonville = you can switch the prices around.

BTW, The point I made about Bush's rookie #'d to 299 and Jones-Drew #'d to 999 was a very valid comment. it goes to the supply and demand issue.

Save the insults- it's a hobby, I'm not on here to lie- where's the benefit. I haven't tracked the two over the last year, but i know there was a time maybe two years ago that Jones-Drew cards were red hot and outselling Bush- the prices in Beckett did not reflect that, you very well could be right over the time period you mentioned.

Name insults?  I'm not sure where I called you any names.  I'm also not sure where you came up with the internet tough-guy thought.  Perhaps it's the same reasoning you used when you told me I was wrong about the pricing - incorrectly so.
I have no problem with you, but I do have a problem when people take things that are far from the truth and present them as fact.  Bush sells higher than Dwill and MJD - it's a fact.  When I used this example to illustrate the point that the best players aren't always the highest priced, you felt the need to correct me - by stating something that was not true.  When you do this, I feel the need to set the record straight.
The rest of what you said I agree with.  The team greatly affects the price of cards.  Reggie Bush is WAY over priced, and MJD's cards are steals.  I even agree that book value is a ridiculous representation of the true value of a card.  Then again, I never disputed any of this.  The only point I was making is that the highest production does not equate to the highest values.

[hemipowered]

Kickstand54 Wrote:
Name insults?  I'm not sure where I called you any names.  I'm also not sure where you came up with the internet tough-guy thought.  Perhaps it's the same reasoning you used when you told me I was wrong about the pricing - incorrectly so.
I have no problem with you, but I do have a problem when people take things that are far from the truth and present them as fact.  Bush sells higher than Dwill and MJD - it's a fact.  When I used this example to illustrate the point that the best players aren't always the highest priced, you felt the need to correct me - by stating something that was not true.  When you do this, I feel the need to set the record straight.
The rest of what you said I agree with.  The team greatly affects the price of cards.  Reggie Bush is WAY over priced, and MJD's cards are steals.  I even agree that book value is a ridiculous representation of the true value of a card.  Then again, I never disputed any of this.  The only point I was making is that the highest production does not equate to the highest values.

I consider the fact you said I was a '"liar" (or potential liar) as an insult. I'm more than happy to debate an issue, but the insult non-sense really serves no purpose. At least where I am from  that is considered an insult. I don't want to get caught up on a tangent because it kind of takes away from what the basic principle of the post intended. I know for a fact there was a time when Bush was out hurt (happens to him quite a bit it seems) and Jones-Drew was set to take over for Fred Taylor- I was tracking the prices of the RBs at the time and he was selling for more. That's it, no big deal. For the time period you mentioned I believe you- end of story, let's move on.

I don't know what you mean by the "highest production does not equate to the highest values" = I believe you mean the lower production doesn't always equate to the higher values"