[jstump37]

MadMan1978 Wrote:#1 was the Jim Mora's Saints ?

NO WAY!

The LB's of the steelers in the 70 were the very best

The Saints squad deserved the #1 position. When the Aints WERE televised, their LB squad was an amazing group to watch. They were better as a unit, too. Individually, the players never really achieved the same success as when they were teammates.

Good call, NFL!

[MadMan1978]

jstump37 Wrote:

MadMan1978 Wrote:#1 was the Jim Mora's Saints ?

NO WAY!

The LB's of the steelers in the 70 were the very best

The Saints squad deserved the #1 position. When the Aints WERE televised, their LB squad was an amazing group to watch. They were better as a unit, too. Individually, the players never really achieved the same success as when they were teammates.

Good call, NFL!

base on what ?
HOFers?
Super Bowls ?
Wins ?

they have this one wrong! PERIOD

[lumm0x]

Fo those that detract from the Saints squad you have to look at it this way. The poll is focusing on just the group of 3 or 4 players. Not the defense as a whole, the team they played on, etc. Team success and such is a small factor, and one that also works in the Saints group favor. The units of many of the other teams were ripe with many other pro bowl players. The Saints LBer group played behind who on the defensive line.... Not many could even name them without looking up this lackluster group of players. The secondary was exactly the same way. The Saints defense was at the top 3 for many years solely on the shoulders of their linebackers. They did not have the likes of Green, Greenwood, and many other pro bowlers on the defense, nor did they have a offense filled with HOFers. The Saints had no offense at all. They had a few decent starters but otherwise they were barely above water. Any team success of the Saints for about a decade came from a dominant defensive performance of 4 players and Morten Anderson nailing 4-5 FG`s per game.

In a 6 year stretch where they were great only 1 other player made a Pro Bowl appearance other than these 4 guys. Rickey Jackson and Pat Swilling have more career sacks than many other guys in the HOF. Jackson`s personal stats are way better than Andre Tippett who just made the HOF and was seen as the AFC version of LT in his day. Bottom line is the Saints as a team could never achieve anything, but it does not overshadow that this foursome of LBers was the best single unit I have ever seen. The only one in my mind that compares closely is the Giants of the same era, but across the board I think the Saints weakest links on the LBers are better than that of the Giants and become a better overall unit. Don`t look at what these other teams achieved, at many times not on the performance of their LBers, but because they had huge offenses or overall great defenses. Some of these teams you could have plugged a mediocre defender into and seen little drop off in results because everyone else was so good.

I have no doubt that this unit, installed in the exponentially better surrounding situation of all of the other nominees, would have even been that much better. Drop these backers into a dream situation like the 70`s Steelers or 85 Bears, where pretty much everyone else was a pro bowler too, and offenses to boot, and you would have seen even more dominant performances than these already great squads produced.

Rickey Jackson in my opinion is the most underrated defensive player of that era. Swilling was as good as anyone as a pass rusher, and little Mills was the smartest player on any field he stepped on, and finally big Vaughan was a crusher rivaled by very few. Any one of these guys was a beast singularly let alone combined as a foursome. Yes, the Saints were a terrible team, but these 4 linebackers were the best unit ever. 4 players turned an otherwise poor defense where other players in the unit would be unlikely starters elsewhere into a top 3 consistent unit with someone the lowest PPG against in the era and some of the biggest sack and fumble recovery stats to match. And they made a team without an offense a contender for the division title for a decade and carried a rag tag team of marginal players on their backs.

But yes....I am very biased

[bloomis1307]

to be honest im suprised the lb unit from the bears latest run at the superbowl was not up there

brian urlacher lance briggs and warrick holdman i believe

[odenfan]

lumm0x Wrote:They got #1 right for sure. The guy at the end said it best. If they had an offense they could have won 2 or 3 Super Bowls. 6 seasons together, 13 Pro Bowls combined and only 1 other player in 6 seasons ever made a Pro Bowl appearance. The Saints only had 4 players from the mid 80's to the early 90's and they were all in the same core position (edit- I'll make an exception for Morten )

The Saints as #1 is a joke. Andy Russell was in 7 Pro Bowls by himself and he didn't make the HOF. The other 2 guys are in the HOF and appeared in 8 and 9 Pro Bowls respectively. That is 24 Pro Bowls between the 3 LBS of the Steelers.

[rickysigai]

i can`t belive the ravens are 10th. that year they were freaking monsters- shut outs, teams didn`t even make it past mid field. we didn`t evenn score a touchdown for a few weeks in a row and still won games becouse of our D

[dfr52]

odenfan Wrote:

lumm0x Wrote:They got #1 right for sure. The guy at the end said it best. If they had an offense they could have won 2 or 3 Super Bowls. 6 seasons together, 13 Pro Bowls combined and only 1 other player in 6 seasons ever made a Pro Bowl appearance. The Saints only had 4 players from the mid 80's to the early 90's and they were all in the same core position (edit- I'll make an exception for Morten )

The Saints as #1 is a joke. Andy Russell was in 7 Pro Bowls by himself and he didn't make the HOF. The other 2 guys are in the HOF and appeared in 8 and 9 Pro Bowls respectively. That is 24 Pro Bowls between the 3 LBS of the Steelers.

Russell earned HOF consideration and wil hopefully make it in someday. The Steelers LB's were highly talented but they were also surrounded by other HOF talent as lumm0x pointed out. The Saints crew wasn't so lucky and were dominant with average talent playing next to them. During the show they show a clip where Bill Walsh states how good there LB core was, and Walsh had the most talented offense at the time.

[dfr52]

rickysigai Wrote:i can`t belive the ravens are 10th. that year they were freaking monsters- shut outs, teams didn`t even make it past mid field. we didn`t evenn score a touchdown for a few weeks in a row and still won games becouse of our D

Their defense also had two awesome space eaters in the middle and a talented secondary. Very similar situation to that of the 70's Steelers.

[lumm0x]

odenfan Wrote:

lumm0x Wrote:They got #1 right for sure. The guy at the end said it best. If they had an offense they could have won 2 or 3 Super Bowls. 6 seasons together, 13 Pro Bowls combined and only 1 other player in 6 seasons ever made a Pro Bowl appearance. The Saints only had 4 players from the mid 80's to the early 90's and they were all in the same core position (edit- I'll make an exception for Morten )

The Saints as #1 is a joke. Andy Russell was in 7 Pro Bowls by himself and he didn't make the HOF. The other 2 guys are in the HOF and appeared in 8 and 9 Pro Bowls respectively. That is 24 Pro Bowls between the 3 LBS of the Steelers.

And again I will repeat...the Steelers had 8 other pro bowl caliber defenders surrounding their LBers, an offense that could single handedly win games for them. All 3 guys do deserve to be in the HOF. They are all great players. Throw their 3 LBers on the worst team in the league and do they make them a playoff contender....maybe. But the Saints LBers did do that to a otherwise poor team and that is why they are recognized for their effect as a unit. I know it is difficult to try to estimate each units effectiveness had they been in a completely different surrounding cast and situation. Put the 4 Saints backers on the 49ers of that era and maybe that defense becomes the best all time. Put the 3 Steeler LBers on the Saints of the 70s and maybe we never know who they are. Not saying this would be the case, but that is the problem with comparing situations and eras.

And surely I wont convince you, but give me this....the Steelers have so much to hang their hat on over the decades. They are arguably one of the greatest franchises in the history of the sport. The Saints have almost nothing to look back on and be proud of. At least this LBer corp gets a glimmer of recognition it was very deserving of.

[steviey2493]

joey porter what an a-hole...someone tore their ACL and hes laughing