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Physical Risk aside, would you confront a shill bidder?
03-19-2012, 09:12 AM (This post was last modified: 03-19-2012 09:17 AM by y2hood.)
Post: #1
Physical Risk aside, would you confront a shill bidder?
I have the realistic opportunity to confront a shill seller from an ebay auction in person. My friend and I did some recon after I smelled a rat and realized this 1 feedback bidder had 100% activity with the same guy on 300 bids.

I'm not one to be a trouble maker, I'm very passive in real life, so the idea of getting my butt stomped is unappealing if this guy's bigger than me. That said, so often us as card collectors/buyers are posting threads on message boards complaining about dishonest sellers doing this. In my case the guy is selling cards on Ebay 50 minutes from my door step. So the idea of starting something with him just via Ebay's buyer protection has me uncomfortable as he can find me no problem. I've paid for the auction and am going to take my lumps of him shilling it $11 over. I mean really, the $11 isn't breaking me, but the principal is what annoys me. Let me also clear the air of when I do get the card, and the envelope has his name/address, I would never by ANY means use that information for ANY illegal activity. At all. (again I'm a big wuss)

Well my bud has taken it a step outside Ebay, which I can't stop a grown man from doing what he wants, and has contacted the guy asking about making an "off E-Bay deal" and if the guy visits a card shop in the seller's hometown. As it stands my friend is friends with the owner of the shop and used that as a reference point, "if you do visit there you can check with him on my reliability."

The seller contacted him back VERY interested in a rendezvous and selling off E-Bay. He frequents the shop and gave his first name. My friend wrote back again and they are arranging stuff.

So the possibility is there that one could confront a shill bidder in person sorta like Chris Hanson on "To Catch a Predator." So many of you have had the unlucky experience of having to deal with one and I've read the anger it's caused you. In a similar situation, what would you do?


EDIT: My friend is stopping contact with the guy. He doesn't want to "bust" one of his friend's biggest customers, even if he's a competing card seller using underhanded tactics. Looks like I'm sticking to official legal means of handling it whether I want to or not now Tongue

Still would love to pick everyone's brains on the subject.

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03-19-2012, 09:25 AM
Post: #2
RE: Physical Risk aside, would you confront a shill bidder?
EXTREMELY bad idea.

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03-19-2012, 09:31 AM (This post was last modified: 03-19-2012 09:33 AM by rgf17.)
Post: #3
RE: Physical Risk aside, would you confront a shill bidder?
just my opinion and some is hypothetical just to make clear: i really don't think it would have been worth it anyways. whether or not it got physical or just stayed verbal it isn't gonna stop the guy. what's one mans (you) opinion on what he does gonna do? not gonna make him "see the light" and say hey maybe i should stop just because you confront him in person. he knows what he's doing and has no problem with it. your confrontation is not gonna sway his career of shilling. plus other than reporting him you have no right to get physical. you'd be in jail before he would if that was to happen. it sucks to be shilled, believe me i agree completely BUT it's not gonna stop and we as buyers have to accept that. time to move on from buying from him and look elsewhere for fair auctions.

not directed at you by any means but damn people, get over the fact it happens. as long as there is ebay there will be shilling. stay away from sellers that are known or regularly accused of shilling. it only makes your collecting miserable to go back and forth on this subject. the horse has been kicked enough.

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03-19-2012, 09:39 AM
Post: #4
RE: Physical Risk aside, would you confront a shill bidder?
(03-19-2012 09:31 AM)rgf17 Wrote:  just my opinion and some is hypothetical just to make clear: i really don't think it would have been worth it anyways. whether or not it got physical or just stayed verbal it isn't gonna stop the guy. what's one mans (you) opinion on what he does gonna do? not gonna make him "see the light" and say hey maybe i should stop just because you confront him in person. he knows what he's doing and has no problem with it. your confrontation is not gonna sway his career of shilling. plus other than reporting him you have no right to get physical. you'd be in jail before he would if that was to happen. it sucks to be shilled, believe me i agree completely BUT it's not gonna stop and we as buyers have to accept that. time to move on from buying from him and look elsewhere for fair auctions.

not directed at you by any means but damn people, get over the fact it happens. as long as there is ebay there will be shilling. stay away from sellers that are known or regularly accused of shilling. it only makes your collecting miserable to go back and forth on this subject. the horse has been kicked enough.
Very well said and I really appreciate you taking the time to write your post.

"we as buyers have to accept that. time to move on from buying from him and look elsewhere for fair auctions. "

I begrudgingly have to agree with you if only that emotion because he had another REALLY awesome card up for bid, but I don't want the b.s. associated with dealing with him. My friend offered to ask him to sell it to him off Ebay, but I told him emphatically, "no." As you said, I'm moving on as far as giving him my business.

You're also right in that no amount of words or mental out thinking of this guy would change his ways anyway. This isn't a Saved by the Bell after school special and the possibility that in a state where it is legal to carry concealed firearms, this guy could easily shoot my fat butt while I'm fussing him over selling practices.

Very good points, again Thank you.

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03-19-2012, 09:40 AM
Post: #5
RE: Physical Risk aside, would you confront a shill bidder?
If you have done your homework and feel that they are pulling certain tactics then by all means let them know that you think something is up and would like an explanation. I have no problem confronting anyone big or small because in the end I will not back down if I feel someone is trying to screw me over.

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03-19-2012, 09:45 AM
Post: #6
RE: Physical Risk aside, would you confront a shill bidder?
(03-19-2012 09:40 AM)onemanstanding Wrote:  If you have done your homework and feel that they are pulling certain tactics then by all means let them know that you think something is up and would like an explanation. I have no problem confronting anyone big or small because in the end I will not back down if I feel someone is trying to screw me over.

I expected to hear a handful of responses like this. I feel like as sports fans, as a whole, there's more bravado and standing up for ourselves than say, (with no disrespect intended) if it was a stamp collection being shilled.

Another auction that he had, which I stopped bidding once I realized what was up, ended with his other account topping my highest bid by $.01. One Penny. So I halfway want to smart off to him if he second chance offers me, but again as I said, this guy isn't in B.F.E., he's an hour from my house. So even if I would hypothetically confront him, and succeed in making him grovel, he could *very* well turn the tables on me in short order. And I don't have my own safety to just consider. I have my very lovely lady's safety, and our cat, to consider.

Thank you again.

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03-19-2012, 09:46 AM
Post: #7
RE: Physical Risk aside, would you confront a shill bidder?
if something bothered me to the point i couldnt let it go then yes i would confront the person, if it is somewhat local. i would first tell him he can go ahead and give me my $11 bucks and all is well or he can cancel christmas this year. im pretty confident he would be shocked that you showed up to confront him and would likely just hand the money over. Even though it would be well deserved, getting physical with the guy would only end up costing you more money and a night in jail.

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03-19-2012, 09:50 AM (This post was last modified: 03-19-2012 09:52 AM by y2hood.)
Post: #8
RE: Physical Risk aside, would you confront a shill bidder?
Ok, it just got "real."

My bud said he was "dropping out" on the matter but the seller just contacted him again. Not only does the guy know the shop owner in my first post, he was in the store the other day when Leaf Metal Draft 2012 hit the streets and we were there buying boxes. He told my bud, "yeah I remember seeing you and your friend last week."

The guy was playing rummy or something and drinking beer with the owner and another guy. So dude already has a visual on me.

If it was hypothetical before, it's definitely fantasy world stuff now. I'm taking my lumps on this one. Dude can already identify me. And he was quite ornery in a friendly setting. Sorry if I'm not coming off like a cranky Clint Eastwood to everyone.

Feel free to continue discussion on the matter but to make perfectly clear, I'm not calling him out period.

(I did report the shilled stuff to Ebay for investigation since that's anonymous)


EDIT: It wasn't the shop owner's friend. It was a customer that was there while we were there. Either way, he still had a visual on us enough to remember us.

Sorry for the constant edits and updates, this is happening real time.

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03-19-2012, 09:53 AM
Post: #9
RE: Physical Risk aside, would you confront a shill bidder?
To quote from the awesome movie Meatballs, "It just doesn't matter."

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03-19-2012, 09:55 AM
Post: #10
RE: Physical Risk aside, would you confront a shill bidder?
No I wouldn't, for 2 reasons.

- There's little chance that he's bigger than me, and I don't like spending nights in jail.
- I'm not in 6th grade any more, when this would have sounded like a perfectly reasonable course of action.

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