`
 (Toll Free)
Post Reply 
Share Thread:
 
Thread Rating:
  • 2 Votes - 3 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
BCCG grading
05-04-2014, 04:50 PM (This post was last modified: 05-04-2014 04:55 PM by rvdue007.)
Post: #11
RE: BCCG grading
I just purchased a BCCG 10 and the card looks better than an identical card I own with a PSA 8 grade. And I've gone over both cards with a magnifying glass. In fact, the PSA 8 corners are clearly not as good as the BCCG 10.
(05-04-2014 04:50 PM)rvdue007 Wrote:  I just purchased a BCCG 10 and the card looks better than an identical card I own with a PSA 8 grade. And I've gone over both cards with a magnifying glass. In fact, the PSA 8 corners are clearly not as good as the BCCG 10.

And just to add, I'd purchase a BCCG 9 over a PSA 8 without thinking twice.
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
05-05-2014, 05:36 AM
Post: #12
RE: BCCG grading
(05-04-2014 04:50 PM)rvdue007 Wrote:  I just purchased a BCCG 10 and the card looks better than an identical card I own with a PSA 8 grade. And I've gone over both cards with a magnifying glass. In fact, the PSA 8 corners are clearly not as good as the BCCG 10.

And just to add, I'd purchase a BCCG 9 over a PSA 8 without thinking twice.

I would study the card myself, regardless of who graded it, and buy the card I prefer instead of worrying what a silly label says that someone I have no idea who they are decided to put on there.
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
05-05-2014, 06:40 AM (This post was last modified: 05-05-2014 07:26 AM by rvdue007.)
Post: #13
RE: BCCG grading
(05-05-2014 05:36 AM)ricelynnevans75 Wrote:  I would study the card myself, regardless of who graded it, and buy the card I prefer instead of worrying what a silly label says that someone I have no idea who they are decided to put on there.

That's hard to do if you're buying a card off of ebay for example, and if you are, then be sure you can return it if you don't like it. Also, you might buy a card that received a grade of 8 for example and after personally examining it, you believe it actually deserves a higher grade, then I'd send it off to a different grading service. Who knows, it might well deserve and receive a much higher grade than it was given by the previous grading service.

When you send a card off to Beckett, then Beckett has graded that card. If you send a card off to PSA, then PSA has graded that card. Any grading service has to strict guide lines to follow so no matter who grades the card within that same grading service, it's given the correct grade. If there are say 20 graders working for PSA, you would expect that your card would receive the same grade no matter which one of the 20 PSA graders graded it. I would think that any good grading service would pass one single test card by all of their graders once once each day to make sure all of their graders are on track. If there is even one out of 20 graders that makes a grading mistake, he/she should be made aware of their mistake(s).
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
05-05-2014, 06:44 AM
Post: #14
RE: BCCG grading
(05-05-2014 06:40 AM)rvdue007 Wrote:  That's hard to do if you're buying a card off of ebay for example and if you are, then be sure you can return it if you don't like it...

+34

-CC WIHPP

[Image: Nolan_Ryan-Banner_zps9f1a8483.jpg]
Special Props to pyr0punk for this Amazing & Killer Banner!!
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
05-05-2014, 03:24 PM (This post was last modified: 05-05-2014 03:26 PM by ricelynnevans75.)
Post: #15
RE: BCCG grading
(05-05-2014 06:40 AM)rvdue007 Wrote:  That's hard to do if you're buying a card off of ebay for example, and if you are, then be sure you can return it if you don't like it. Also, you might buy a card that received a grade of 8 for example and after personally examining it, you believe it actually deserves a higher grade, then I'd send it off to a different grading service. Who knows, it might well deserve and receive a much higher grade than it was given by the previous grading service.

When you send a card off to Beckett, then Beckett has graded that card. If you send a card off to PSA, then PSA has graded that card. Any grading service has to strict guide lines to follow so no matter who grades the card within that same grading service, it's given the correct grade. If there are say 20 graders working for PSA, you would expect that your card would receive the same grade no matter which one of the 20 PSA graders graded it. I would think that any good grading service would pass one single test card by all of their graders once once each day to make sure all of their graders are on track. If there is even one out of 20 graders that makes a grading mistake, he/she should be made aware of their mistake(s).

I think this was a solid post. However, and not for argumentative reasons but just for the purpose of discussion, I would like to throw out a few other issues.

1) I'm glad you recognize that each company has their own standards/criteria for grading. Some definitions are definitely stronger than others as outlined in the brief descriptions on the companies' websites. Regardless, it's all in how these are applied. AND, it really shouldn't matter WHO grades it as a mint card should be a mint card regardless. It's the same card but the label is different. Then one could get into the "well this criteria is stronger etc etc etc" so they must be right. But are they really? If a card that is truly mint receives a NM/MT or NM/MT+ grade from another company, who's to say that one company was right or wrong? One company could be over grading while the other may very well be under grading. While the specifications are great to have, all of them are still open ended leaving a margin of error.

2) Ideally, yes, regardless of who the grader is at company X, the grade should be the same as they should all be going by the same standards. With that said, these are human beings we're talking about here and nobody is perfect or going to be thinking the same. Again, nobodies grading criteria are perfect and they all have loose ends. Add in the mix the human factor and you very well could get a different grade each time. Say a guy went out one night and had a great date or something and got lucky. His mood, other than being tired, is probably going to be pretty damn good and he may very well be a little more "giving" in a certain area. While the next grader may have been told the night before that his buddy was killed by a drunken driver. His mood and way of thinking is going to definitely be different than the other guy and he may just not care as much that particular day. I do believe there should be some sort of system where it's not just one guy looking at a card, and I'm sure there is SOMETHING to verify this stuff but I'm not certain on that. With the number of cards each of these companies sees every day, it's probably pretty tough to have multiple graders check each card.

3) Personally, I have yet to have any fanboy of whatever grading company be able to provide proof as to why company X is better/worse than the other in terms of grading. In terms of the type of encasing I can understand that for the most part, though it ultimately all boils down to what each persons preference is and a preference can't really be right/wrong in this area as far as I'm concerned. The standards are online, but again, with the human element in the process, it's not concrete as it all boils down to how well that standard is applied at that given moment by the particular grader. I've seen counterfeit cards in all three of the big three (PSA/SGC/BGS-BVG), I've seen scans of the same card receiving different grades from the same company after multiple trips to said company (one went three times to one company, receiving three different grades each time, starting at NM/MT+, then Mint, then Gem Mint), and I've seen scans of cards receiving higher/lesser grades when trying to cross over from one company to the next going each way in between each company.

While the definitions SHOULD make grading an objective process, and possibly could if they were all MUCH more clearer and stricter, the human factor and the looseness of the definitions makes it more subjective in the end. Bottom line, it's all based on personal preference for each individual.
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
05-06-2014, 06:20 AM
Post: #16
RE: BCCG grading
(05-05-2014 03:24 PM)ricelynnevans75 Wrote:  I think this was a solid post. However, and not for argumentative reasons but just for the purpose of discussion, I would like to throw out a few other issues.

1) I'm glad you recognize that each company has their own standards/criteria for grading. Some definitions are definitely stronger than others as outlined in the brief descriptions on the companies' websites. Regardless, it's all in how these are applied. AND, it really shouldn't matter WHO grades it as a mint card should be a mint card regardless. It's the same card but the label is different. Then one could get into the "well this criteria is stronger etc etc etc" so they must be right. But are they really? If a card that is truly mint receives a NM/MT or NM/MT+ grade from another company, who's to say that one company was right or wrong? One company could be over grading while the other may very well be under grading. While the specifications are great to have, all of them are still open ended leaving a margin of error.

2) Ideally, yes, regardless of who the grader is at company X, the grade should be the same as they should all be going by the same standards. With that said, these are human beings we're talking about here and nobody is perfect or going to be thinking the same. Again, nobodies grading criteria are perfect and they all have loose ends. Add in the mix the human factor and you very well could get a different grade each time. Say a guy went out one night and had a great date or something and got lucky. His mood, other than being tired, is probably going to be pretty damn good and he may very well be a little more "giving" in a certain area. While the next grader may have been told the night before that his buddy was killed by a drunken driver. His mood and way of thinking is going to definitely be different than the other guy and he may just not care as much that particular day. I do believe there should be some sort of system where it's not just one guy looking at a card, and I'm sure there is SOMETHING to verify this stuff but I'm not certain on that. With the number of cards each of these companies sees every day, it's probably pretty tough to have multiple graders check each card.

3) Personally, I have yet to have any fanboy of whatever grading company be able to provide proof as to why company X is better/worse than the other in terms of grading. In terms of the type of encasing I can understand that for the most part, though it ultimately all boils down to what each persons preference is and a preference can't really be right/wrong in this area as far as I'm concerned. The standards are online, but again, with the human element in the process, it's not concrete as it all boils down to how well that standard is applied at that given moment by the particular grader. I've seen counterfeit cards in all three of the big three (PSA/SGC/BGS-BVG), I've seen scans of the same card receiving different grades from the same company after multiple trips to said company (one went three times to one company, receiving three different grades each time, starting at NM/MT+, then Mint, then Gem Mint), and I've seen scans of cards receiving higher/lesser grades when trying to cross over from one company to the next going each way in between each company.

While the definitions SHOULD make grading an objective process, and possibly could if they were all MUCH more clearer and stricter, the human factor and the looseness of the definitions makes it more subjective in the end. Bottom line, it's all based on personal preference for each individual.

This is a very well written post. Most of these posts are biased as I am biased towards BGS myself but there is nothing here I can argue with, or discuss lol. Very well said.

Collecting = Peyton Manning
Manning PC
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
05-06-2014, 01:50 PM
Post: #17
RE: BCCG grading
Another problem I perceive is the "Centering" grade. If the card manufacturers are inconsistent in centering the same card, then a Centering grade would be applied to the final grade of the card. But if all the cards produced by the card manufacturer of one identical card are all equally off-center, how then would the "Centering" grade be applied since all identical cards are all equally off-centered??? If all cards made of say card "2014 Topps Super Veteran David Ortiz #SV-6" are all equally off-centered, then how can a "Centering" grade be applicable since all of the #SV-6's are off-centered???
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
05-06-2014, 02:04 PM
Post: #18
RE: BCCG grading
(05-06-2014 01:50 PM)rvdue007 Wrote:  Another problem I perceive is the "Centering" grade. If the card manufacturers are inconsistent in centering the same card, then a Centering grade would be applied to the final grade of the card. But if all the cards produced by the card manufacturer of one identical card are all equally off-center, how then would the "Centering" grade be applied since all identical cards are all equally off-centered??? If all cards made of say card "2014 Topps Super Veteran David Ortiz #SV-6" are all equally off-centered, then how can a "Centering" grade be applicable since all of the #SV-6's are off-centered???

For some card series (the year, card manufacturer, etc.), that is factored into the algorithm.

[Image: Nolan_Ryan-Banner_zps9f1a8483.jpg]
Special Props to pyr0punk for this Amazing & Killer Banner!!
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
05-06-2014, 02:26 PM
Post: #19
RE: BCCG grading
(05-06-2014 02:04 PM)nolan5000 Wrote:  For some card series (the year, card manufacturer, etc.), that is factored into the algorithm.

So you're saying that not only is the grade of the card effected by possible damage done to the card after it is removed from the pack but imperfections that are produced by the card manufacturers themselves?

And if there is a manufacturer error to a card, wouldn't that increase the value of the card not unlike a coin or stamp would have a greater value in that case??
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
05-06-2014, 02:49 PM
Post: #20
RE: BCCG grading
(05-06-2014 02:26 PM)rvdue007 Wrote:  So you're saying that not only is the grade of the card effected by possible damage done to the card after it is removed from the pack but imperfections that are produced by the card manufacturers themselves?

And if there is a manufacturer error to a card, wouldn't that increase the value of the card not unlike a coin or stamp would have a greater value in that case??

I don't know the answer to your 2nd question.

Maybe I caused you confusion on your 1st question. Put it like this. I'll go with your off-centering example. Say that a certain card series is predisposed to centering problems. This is taken into consideration in the card's grade algorithm. So in other words, a card series whose off-centering is a problem, Beckett is more forgiving on the Centering subgrade.

[Image: Nolan_Ryan-Banner_zps9f1a8483.jpg]
Special Props to pyr0punk for this Amazing & Killer Banner!!
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
Post Reply 


Forum Jump:


User(s) browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)