[kenarm79]

Everyone seems to have an opinion on collecting. It's like Dems & Republicans, lol. This is what I feel and concluded:

Panini didn't destroy the hobby:
UD (which I miss) had problems, Topps had problems, Fleer had problems (you seen what happen to them) even Press Pass had problems. That being said, those companies opened the door for Panini. I didn't like when Panini came out because they said that they were going to bring something new to the Hobby (I'm still waiting). I don't have a problem with them making money. I'm not a big fan, but someone else is.

Pricing has been high since 1989:
When UD introduced the $1 pack, the hobby hasn't been the same. Fleer & Topps used to give you 300 cards per pack for 25-50 cents, lol. I don't really have a problem with pricing. If you can sell something for a certain amount, then do it. Remember UD came out with Exquisite (that's about 2-3 car payments). You still can hit or miss with that product.

Yes GU & auto's aren't what they used to be:
Look at this way. When computers first came out, you practically had to take out a loan to get one. Now you can buy a computer for a couple hundred dollars that's 100x better than the original Mac. When GU first hit the seen, they were revolutionary. The aura of them has faded. You might not like the player you receive, but I'm sure someone wants it.

Sellers didn't kill the hobby:
If a person that was solely in this to make money killed the hobby, then you might not have had the opportunity to get the stuff you have. Practically all of my PC came from the secondary market.

Everyone has the right to there opinion:
The reasons why you collect may be totally different than mine. It makes the hobby more interesting.

Boxes usually Never give you the return on your money:
If boxes did, then LCS's would open all of them and sell the contents. To drive home this point, a LCS owner told me years ago that they stopped busting wax. There reason was that they would loose too much money if they did it. That's why you have case hits and so forth. Remember when packs used to state the odds on the back. When compaines stopped doing it people started complaining, because the wanted to know the chances of pulling something.

Some people have more luck:
I knew someone who pulled around 10-15 Tiger Woods auto's. It seem like he had all the luck. He would sell them for $150-250. When Tiger stopped signing, all of his stuff went threw the roof. He used to kick himself because the same cards were selling for 3-5x what he sold them for.

Nothing killed the hobby:
Everything changes and evolves. If the hobby was dead you wouldn't be reading this, lol.

Collecting is suppose to be fun. Remember the reasons why you collect & pass it on.

[magneto2]

Well said.

[gjpoll1]

Everyone seems to have an opinion on collecting. It's like Dems & Republicans, lol. This is what I feel and concluded:

Panini didn't destroy the hobby:
UD (which I miss) had problems, Topps had problems, Fleer had problems (you seen what happen to them) even Press Pass had problems. That being said, those companies opened the door for Panini. I didn't like when Panini came out because they said that they were going to bring something new to the Hobby (I'm still waiting). I don't have a problem with them making money. I'm not a big fan, but someone else is.

Pricing has been high since 1989:
When UD introduced the $1 pack, the hobby hasn't been the same. Fleer & Topps used to give you 300 cards per pack for 25-50 cents, lol. I don't really have a problem with pricing. If you can sell something for a certain amount, then do it. Remember UD came out with Exquisite (that's about 2-3 car payments). You still can hit or miss with that product.

Yes GU & auto's aren't what they used to be:
Look at this way. When computers first came out, you practically had to take out a loan to get one. Now you can buy a computer for a couple hundred dollars that's 100x better than the original Mac. When GU first hit the seen, they were revolutionary. The aura of them has faded. You might not like the player you receive, but I'm sure someone wants it.

Sellers didn't kill the hobby:
If a person that was solely in this to make money killed the hobby, then you might not have had the opportunity to get the stuff you have. Practically all of my PC came from the secondary market.

Everyone has the right to there opinion:
The reasons why you collect may be totally different than mine. It makes the hobby more interesting.

Boxes usually Never give you the return on your money:
If boxes did, then LCS's would open all of them and sell the contents. To drive home this point, a LCS owner told me years ago that they stopped busting wax. There reason was that they would loose too much money if they did it. That's why you have case hits and so forth. Remember when packs used to state the odds on the back. When compaines stopped doing it people started complaining, because the wanted to know the chances of pulling something.

Some people have more luck:
I knew someone who pulled around 10-15 Tiger Woods auto's. It seem like he had all the luck. He would sell them for $150-250. When Tiger stopped signing, all of his stuff went threw the roof. He used to kick himself because the same cards were selling for 3-5x what he sold them for.

Nothing killed the hobby:
Everything changes and evolves. If the hobby was dead you wouldn't be reading this, lol.

Collecting is suppose to be fun. Remember the reasons why you collect & pass it on.

DITTO!!

[eazy e]

Nice post Kenarm79 !

[ShaqEatsThat]

i want YOUR autograph, well said

[evanturner12]

The hobby kind of died in 2000 right?

Trading cards were very popular in the 90s, but the trend wore off. The people collecting cards now are true collectors. I did prefer the cards from the 90s because the designs seemed to have more effort in them because autos weren't common and GU was mid 90s. Plus back then you could mail a card to a player and they would sign them. You probably couldn't get the all-stars because they would have had so much mail, but you could get decent players for the most part. Now players aren't allowed to sign cards if they have an exclusive deal with panini about auto cards.

[briankort]

I'm not huge into collecting like a lot of guys here and I am definitely not putting anyone down. The hobby is fun, but the way I see it is sort of like this. The market today is flooded with cards for each player. Sure it makes cards available to a lot of collectors, but it brings long term value down.

For example. How many RC's did Larry Bird have? Or Michael Jordan or anyone before 1988 (give or take a year). The answer is one. That is why pre-1988 star/HOF cards are worth so much, especially when graded high.

How many RC's (rookie year) cards does kobe have? 95

How many RC's (rookie year) cards does Lebron have? 489

Do we start to see a trend? There are very very few players now days whose cards will have any real value in the next 10-20 years.

[kenarm79]

I'm not huge into collecting like a lot of guys here and I am definitely not putting anyone down. The hobby is fun, but the way I see it is sort of like this. The market today is flooded with cards for each player. Sure it makes cards available to a lot of collectors, but it brings long term value down.

For example. How many RC's did Larry Bird have? Or Michael Jordan or anyone before 1988 (give or take a year). The answer is one. That is why pre-1988 star/HOF cards are worth so much, especially when graded high.

How many RC's (rookie year) cards does kobe have? 95

How many RC's (rookie year) cards does Lebron have? 489

Do we start to see a trend? There are very very few players now days whose cards will have any real value in the next 10-20 years.

Try to see it this way. Even though Topps produced Larry Bird's rookie card, they actually made 6 different ones. Only one is reconized as his true RC. The print runs back then were off the charts. That's what helped doom Fleer. LeBron may have 400+ RC's, but the print runs aren't large.

It's a reason why a lot of cards from the 80's-90's have less value. Remember you have two of the ALL TIME GREATS on one RC (Bird & Magic), and LeBron has at least 20-40 cards from is rookie year that's worth the same amount or more. You might have more RC cards available, but the quantities aren't moving at the rate that you may think. The amount may have increased a little threw the years, but that all depends on the demand.

When LeBron came out he was considered the next big thing. He was still in HS at the time. No one had seen that type of hype before him. Naturally everyone wanted a piece of him. UD signed him and produced more cards for him then they normally would (Chris Bosh dosen't have the same amount of cards as LeBron. Demand isn't as high for him).

Think back. MJ's Star cards were regionally produced (that's why it's not considered a true RC). Not everyone had the chance to get one. That's what drove up the demand for one. Now that the internet is here, prices have dropped for those cards. People are able to get their hands on one with more ease.

What happen in the 80's-90's created what you see today. Companies over produced the exact same card. It brought the values down. They then started to create different brands under the same umbrella. So they never stopped producing large quantities, they just changed the way they produce them.

That's why you see Topps, Topps Chrome, Topps Luxury Box, Topps Treasury, UD, SP Authentic, SPX, Exquisite, etc.

[briankort]

I don't disagree with you, I just see so much money invested on new rookies only to see them be worth less than 1/2 price or worse 1or 2 years later. I was in the Lebron hype and dropped a lot of change on boxes and packs. But what did I have in the end when it was all done? Maybe 2 or 3 $200-$300 cards and then about 1800 cards that were worth less than $5 a piece. I easily bought 20 boxes at $100 or more. That's $2000. I could have bought any Lebron RC AUTO with that and still had plenty left over for a few more nice cards.

I know it is exciting cracking open a pack and hoping to get that $1000 card everybody wants. The problem is that only about 5% of the people (or less) actually pull that card. I still buy a few packs and maybe a box now and then, but I have found my money is invested alot more wisely, just buying the card off the bay or from a seller on here. At over $100 for a basic box of cards it doesn't take long before you can buy the Kobe auto's and the Jordan patches. And it is the only way your guaranteed to get the cards you want. (with the exception of 1/1 and low print run cards)

With that said, everyone collects and spends their money in their own way. My opinion or yours isn't going to change that. In the end as long as everyone has fun and enjoys what they do, then who am I to tell them to do it another way.

[vgqv]

Greed is, what I won't say destroyed this hobby but it's what has us currently in the Panini era because David Stern didn't feel UD & Topps were paying enough money for the license. In comes the higher bidder, Panini.

Oh wait, you say they're a company based overseas...where? Italy? Wow, really? Europe...where the NBA is trying to expand and have games...

I blankiddy blank blank blank...david stern.